Full auto demo fun.

Styx

Since 6981 Days

Posted by Myro

For me that game is horrible. Its just totally missing some thing.

Edit: oh its missing fun.

I've been doing some thinking.... and somehow i totally agree!

In reply to

Sheps

Since 6944 Days

missing fun?? lol the game is great fun.

From the demo anyway, reminds me of interstate 76, a great game to play with your mates, games like this dont need depth with "funability" :D

In reply to

Freniger

Since 7019 Days

Are you kidding me? This game is garbage. The physics can never be appreciated, the destructable enviroments hardly affect the race, the weapons are almost useless. the graphics are bad, the framerate is horrendous (smooth at 60fps? lmao), and the car physics are laughable. There is no sense of grip. It feels like you're ice-skating rather than driving a muscle car. How can you praise this game? It's trash. I'm surprised they actually released a demo for Full Auto. I can't imagine how it could convince anyone to buy the game.

And don't be like "bu bu its only a demo!!!". I realize this, but there is just no possible way they could fix all these problems in a month. The game is going to be bad. End of story.

In reply to

Slabs

Since 7033 Days

Freniger the demo is from well before Christmas you have to understand, it would be several months. I doubt they've fixed everything though, which is a shame.

In reply to

Styx

Since 6981 Days

I don't even think it's a shame, it had no potential to begin with IMO :/

In reply to

jubilex

Since 6868 Days

I was very much not into the game, but the framerate seemed smooth for 95% of the time and the few drops were only for a frame or two and barely noticeable.

In reply to

SimonM7

Since 7026 Days

The fact that this game essentially started out as a tech demo didn't inspire much confidence. A game that has cars with guns don't exactly inspire confidence either. To be truthful, I've found pretty much every racing game with guns, including Twisted Metal and Vigilante 8 completely rubbish.

Now, when I fired this game up I basically knew two things; it's published by Sega, and a lot of people have stated that they were pleasantly surprised by it. I didn't expect to be, though.

It crashed on me pretty much right away, I couldn't control the car and then it just froze. I could still use the guide, so I used that to go back to the dashboard and restarted the demo. This time it worked briefly, but using unwreck caused it to crash again, completely this time. Hrmpf!

So I restarted the 360 and decided to give it yet another shot. This time it worked, but I really couldn't get a feel for the whole shooting stuff/getting boost balance. I figured there had to be some kind of combo system in there so that you could use boost tactically and still build the boost up fairly quickly. The key to enjoying any game is to learn what the hell you're supposed to be doing in it. Just because it looks like something you've played doesn't mean you can expect it to play like that. People to this day whine about Crazy Taxi being shallow - and they don't even know about the maneuvers in that game, the whole point!

So yeah, I spent some time getting to grips with that, and I'm pretty much pre-ordering the game right now. It's completely and utterly nuts. It's just.. insane. When you're launched towards the sign on the hotel building, blow a hole in it with a missile, shoot your way through the hotel lobby windows with three other cars and landing in a rain of gunfire and shards of glass and metal on the street below your head just spins around frantically going "WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!"

At this point I don't even care if it gets high scores or not. It's not terribly sophisticated, and its balance is questionable. Some cars can drop grenades behind them, so when they're in the lead and going through a narrow alley you're pretty much screwed if you're right on their tail. Despite that, when it goes your way and you pull off these death (crash?) defying stunts and go flying through shit and actually managing to emerge on the other side, it's just simply a ton of fun.

In reply to

The fact that this game essentially started out as a tech demo didn't inspire much confidence. A game that has cars with guns don't exactly inspire confidence either. To be truthful, I've found pretty much every racing game with guns, including Twisted Metal and Vigilante 8 completely rubbish.

Now, when I fired this game up I basically knew two things; it's published by Sega, and a lot of people have stated that they were pleasantly surprised by it. I didn't expect to be, though.

It crashed on me pretty much right away, I couldn't control the car and then it just froze. I could still use the guide, so I used that to go back to the dashboard and restarted the demo. This time it worked briefly, but using unwreck caused it to crash again, completely this time. Hrmpf!

So I restarted the 360 and decided to give it yet another shot. This time it worked, but I really couldn't get a feel for the whole shooting stuff/getting boost balance. I figured there had to be some kind of combo system in there so that you could use boost tactically and still build the boost up fairly quickly. The key to enjoying any game is to learn what the hell you're supposed to be doing in it. Just because it looks like something you've played doesn't mean you can expect it to play like that. People to this day whine about Crazy Taxi being shallow - and they don't even know about the maneuvers in that game, the whole point!

So yeah, I spent some time getting to grips with that, and I'm pretty much pre-ordering the game right now. It's completely and utterly nuts. It's just.. insane. When you're launched towards the sign on the hotel building, blow a hole in it with a missile, shoot your way through the hotel lobby windows with three other cars and landing in a rain of gunfire and shards of glass and metal on the street below your head just spins around frantically going "WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!"

At this point I don't even care if it gets high scores or not. It's not terribly sophisticated, and its balance is questionable. Some cars can drop grenades behind them, so when they're in the lead and going through a narrow alley you're pretty much screwed if you're right on their tail. Despite that, when it goes your way and you pull off these death (crash?) defying stunts and go flying through shit and actually managing to emerge on the other side, it's just simply a ton of fun.

An Elegant Tapestry of Aphorisms - The musings of a brilliant self proclaimed gaming philosopher.
http://aetoa.blogspot.com

Jollipop

Since 6886 Days

It surprises me that any of you thought this was going to be a good game.

It had BAD written all over it from the moment i saw it at E3, is it me or are games becoming more for the casual gamer ?

In reply to

Inflatable

Since 7641 Days

Posted by Jollipop

is it me or are games becoming more for the casual gamer ?

This is an arcade game, what did you expect?

Still plenty of more 'hardcore' games coming, don't worry..

In reply to

www.cyberwarriors.nl

McErono

Since 6964 Days

from the 1up.com blog of cord smith (pseudointeractive):

The Infamous Full Auto Demo
This BLOG is a great place to answer questions and field comments in a down-to-earth way. Obviously, game development isn't easy. When you combine completely separate disciplines, gigs of complex content, thousands upon thousands of lines of code, and the need to create a comprehensive whole that will easily interact with gamers from all walks of life, you're facing challenges that no other medium has to consider.

And while speculation is entertaining, most gamers aren't privy to the insane amount of issues that crop up "behind the scenes" at a typical--or atypical in this case--development studio.

Case in point: why release a demo in January that seems to bear little resemblance to the final product that's shipping in only a few weeks. Well, let's first get to the bottom of the mysterious code speculation: the OXM demo and the recently released Marketplace demo are indeed the same code, and given the fact that our development process forces us to branch demo code out from the main code base, you might consider August as the real origin of the final demo code. Although minor alterations were made to address feedback from Microsoft, the main code base continued to evolve while the demo code base remained locked so that it would remain stable.

This meant elements like our ongoing car handling, weapon tuning, HUD overhaul, front end enhancements, lighting tweaks, one touch replay system, pre-race presentation, etc. were not included in the demo. But since we're dealing with a new IP, it's essential that we pushed the demo out as early as possible to ensure that gamers got a good sense of the final game.

Demos (E3, G-phoria, X'05, OXM, Marketplace, etc.) had a major impact on our development cycle as it was, so putting more effort into an updated one late in development would have seriously compromised the overall quality and polish of the final game. This is a conundrum many developers deal with when making their master schedules. No one can deny the importance of creating a demo in today's marketplace, but you have to ask yourself "at what cost?" When timeframes are tight, the full game will always take precedence. Just look to Microsoft's showing at E3 2005 for evidence of this. It's likely that you didn't see PGR3 or Perfect Dark Zero on the show floor because those teams were instructed to prioritize the full version of the game at that time. Not until X'05 did the press get their hands-on experience with those games out in the open at an official event.

It should be noted that demos undergo a certification process very similar to the final game, meaning you can't just wrap up a demo and post it online by yourself. The demo must go through internal QA, publisher QA, and then submission to the 1st party. This process can take many weeks depending upon the complexity of the demo as well as any iterations that are needed based upon feedback from any of the 3 QA groups. Although the Xbox Live Marketplace now allows us a powerful distribution tool for getting demos to the public, getting a demo on a disc such as OXM adds even more time to the equation since the code must be verified, laid into the cover disc and interface layout, the discs must then be replicated, the demos and magazines must be combined, and mailing delays must be taken into account. You can understand that this is not an overnight process, and thus getting a demo out prior to the launch of your game necessitates using older code.

Anyway, we're quite proud of the Full Auto demo, even though it's a bit of a relic compared to the quality of the final game. I'm glad to hear that many of you are enjoying it and can see the inherent promise of the final game even though you're experiencing older code. The demo does have a few interesting quirks that the final game does not:

1) I believe both the 1P and 2P controllers can control the car at the same time so if you play it smart, one person can drive while the other mans the weapons--this was a bug but some gamers seem to think it's a feature we missed out on keeping in the final game.

2) The aiming constraints on the missile launcher are much more forgiving in the demo version of the game so you'll find that you can target areas that you aren't able to in the final game. This change was made to better balance the weapon load-outs, but there is something to be said for having greater range (fair or not).

So that's a bit of background on making demos. Hopefully I've addressed some of your questions.

In reply to

from the 1up.com blog of cord smith (pseudointeractive):

The Infamous Full Auto Demo 
This BLOG is a great place to answer questions and field comments in a down-to-earth way. Obviously, game development isn't easy. When you combine completely separate disciplines, gigs of complex content, thousands upon thousands of lines of code, and the need to create a comprehensive whole that will easily interact with gamers from all walks of life, you're facing challenges that no other medium has to consider.

And while speculation is entertaining, most gamers aren't privy to the insane amount of issues that crop up "behind the scenes" at a typical--or atypical in this case--development studio.

Case in point: why release a demo in January that seems to bear little resemblance to the final product that's shipping in only a few weeks. Well, let's first get to the bottom of the mysterious code speculation: the OXM demo and the recently released Marketplace demo are indeed the same code, and given the fact that our development process forces us to branch demo code out from the main code base, you might consider August as the real origin of the final demo code. Although minor alterations were made to address feedback from Microsoft, the main code base continued to evolve while the demo code base remained locked so that it would remain stable.

This meant elements like our ongoing car handling, weapon tuning, HUD overhaul, front end enhancements, lighting tweaks, one touch replay system, pre-race presentation, etc. were not included in the demo. But since we're dealing with a new IP, it's essential that we pushed the demo out as early as possible to ensure that gamers got a good sense of the final game.

Demos (E3, G-phoria, X'05, OXM, Marketplace, etc.) had a major impact on our development cycle as it was, so putting more effort into an updated one late in development would have seriously compromised the overall quality and polish of the final game. This is a conundrum many developers deal with when making their master schedules. No one can deny the importance of creating a demo in today's marketplace, but you have to ask yourself "at what cost?" When timeframes are tight, the full game will always take precedence. Just look to Microsoft's showing at E3 2005 for evidence of this. It's likely that you didn't see PGR3 or Perfect Dark Zero on the show floor because those teams were instructed to prioritize the full version of the game at that time. Not until X'05 did the press get their hands-on experience with those games out in the open at an official event.

It should be noted that demos undergo a certification process very similar to the final game, meaning you can't just wrap up a demo and post it online by yourself. The demo must go through internal QA, publisher QA, and then submission to the 1st party. This process can take many weeks depending upon the complexity of the demo as well as any iterations that are needed based upon feedback from any of the 3 QA groups. Although the Xbox Live Marketplace now allows us a powerful distribution tool for getting demos to the public, getting a demo on a disc such as OXM adds even more time to the equation since the code must be verified, laid into the cover disc and interface layout, the discs must then be replicated, the demos and magazines must be combined, and mailing delays must be taken into account. You can understand that this is not an overnight process, and thus getting a demo out prior to the launch of your game necessitates using older code.

Anyway, we're quite proud of the Full Auto demo, even though it's a bit of a relic compared to the quality of the final game. I'm glad to hear that many of you are enjoying it and can see the inherent promise of the final game even though you're experiencing older code. The demo does have a few interesting quirks that the final game does not:

1) I believe both the 1P and 2P controllers can control the car at the same time so if you play it smart, one person can drive while the other mans the weapons--this was a bug but some gamers seem to think it's a feature we missed out on keeping in the final game.

2) The aiming constraints on the missile launcher are much more forgiving in the demo version of the game so you'll find that you can target areas that you aren't able to in the final game. This change was made to better balance the weapon load-outs, but there is something to be said for having greater range (fair or not).

So that's a bit of background on making demos. Hopefully I've addressed some of your questions.

Terra

Since 6884 Days

Played it today (via oxm cover disc, sadly no xbox live for me yet… groan…), true, not the deepest game ever but good old arcade fun. Maybe it’ll be a rental for me.

In reply to

SimonM7

Since 7026 Days

http://www.eurogamer.net/article.php?article_id=62...

Good interview.

Oh and may I suggest to mods/admins that this thread is renamed simply "Full Auto" for official-ness?

In reply to

An Elegant Tapestry of Aphorisms - The musings of a brilliant self proclaimed gaming philosopher.
http://aetoa.blogspot.com

Moz

Since 6950 Days

Blimy eurogamer being positive about the X360 has hell frozen over?

In reply to

McErono

Since 6964 Days

Tnx Simon!

quote:

We were also busy prototyping our gameplay mechanics and attempting to understand just how far we'd be able to take our vision given the new hardware," says Smith of the development process.

Indeed, whether they've taken it too far is actually a point of contention following previews like ours that pointed to a bit of slowdown, and performance issues with the demo that appeared on Live Marketplace on January 25th. Smith says not to worry. "During the final phases of development, we made every effort to utilise all three cores through threaded rendering and other techniques.

"I believe you'll notice a very large improvement in overall performance, although we plan to push the limits much further now that the hardware is finalised and we have time to re-engineer our technology to maximise the benefits within each area of our codebase." Which is the developer for "it'll be quicker out of the box, guv".

In reply to

maharoba

Since 6977 Days

I'm definately renting this game. If the online is fun then I'll buy it.

In reply to

PlumbDrumb

Since 6996 Days

Posted by SimonM7

Oh and may I suggest to mods/admins that this thread is renamed simply "Full Auto" for official-ness?

This will happen only if the thread starter requests it.

In reply to

"That stuff is so strong, it's religious"

SimonM7

Since 7026 Days

Ah yes, of course.

In reply to

An Elegant Tapestry of Aphorisms - The musings of a brilliant self proclaimed gaming philosopher.
http://aetoa.blogspot.com

McErono

Since 6964 Days

well I just played the full retail version for an hour...

the game sits on the shelves since 3. feb. here in Switzerland.

they have added some nice FX like some kind of shock wave when a missile explodes or refelctions on the tarmac, very nice smoke and sun lightening.

sad but true thats all positive about the retail version. The slowdowns are massive. They just happen even if nothing is going on on the screen, sometimes you blow half the city apart and the framerate takes no hit, then you drive just without shooting and enemies and the framerate goes down.

once I shot a truck and the framerate was about 5fps for 30sec!!! the dealer saw it and was afraid his demo 360 is just falling apart but it was the game. after some time the sound stopped... no FX, no music anymore... there is a soundbug or something.

I am realy sorry but I can't tell you better things about the game... that hour was it for me, I wont buy it. I was bored afterwards and I will invest my money into Burnout Revenge.

I have no idea why a developer is telling us something else (much better performance), delays his game "to make it perfect" an the result is so bad.

In reply to

well I just played the full retail version for an hour...

the game sits on the shelves since 3. feb. here in Switzerland.

they have added some nice FX like some kind of shock wave when a missile explodes or refelctions on the tarmac, very nice smoke and sun lightening.

sad but true thats all positive about the retail version. The slowdowns are massive. They just happen even if nothing is going on on the screen, sometimes you blow half the city apart and the framerate takes no hit, then you drive just without shooting and enemies and the framerate goes down.

once I shot a truck and the framerate was about 5fps for 30sec!!! the dealer saw it and was afraid his demo 360 is just falling apart but it was the game. after some time the sound stopped... no FX, no music anymore... there is a soundbug or something.

I am realy sorry but I can't tell you better things about the game... that hour was it for me, I wont buy it. I was bored afterwards and I will invest my money into Burnout Revenge.

I have no idea why a developer is telling us something else (much better performance), delays his game "to make it perfect" an the result is so bad.

Panzer83

Since 6938 Days

Posted by McErono

well I just played the full retail version for an hour...

the game sits on the shelves since 3. feb.

the have added some nice FX like some kind of shock wave when a missile explodes or refelctions on the tarmac, very nice smoke and sun lightening.

sad but true thats all positive about the retail version. The slowdowns are massive. They just happen even if nothing is going on on the screen, sometimes you blow half the city apart and the framerate takes no hit, then you drive just without shooting and enemies and the framerate goes down.

once I shot a truck and the framerate was about 5fps for 30sec!!! the dealer saw it and was afraid his demo 360 is just falling apart but it was the game. after some time the sound stopped... no FX, no music anymore... ther is a soundbug or something.

I am realy sorry but I can't tell you better things about the game... that hour was it for me, I wont buy it. I was bored afterwards and I will invest my money into Burnout Revenge.

I have no idea why a developer is telling us something else (much better performance), delays his game "to make it perfect" an the result is so bad.

After reading that and the OXM review I'm very disheartened. The demo was ultra fun and I was looking forward to this game but I might as well rent it first based on said reviews.

In reply to

[quote=McErono]well I just played the full retail version for an hour...

the game sits on the shelves since 3. feb.

the have added some nice FX like some kind of shock wave when a missile explodes or refelctions on the tarmac, very nice smoke and sun lightening.

sad but true thats all positive about the retail version. The slowdowns are massive. They just happen even if nothing is going on on the screen, sometimes you blow half the city apart and the framerate takes no hit, then you drive just without shooting and enemies and the framerate goes down.

once I shot a truck and the framerate was about 5fps for 30sec!!! the dealer saw it and was afraid his demo 360 is just falling apart but it was the game. after some time the sound stopped... no FX, no music anymore... ther is a soundbug or something.

I am realy sorry but I can't tell you better things about the game... that hour was it for me, I wont buy it. I was bored afterwards and I will invest my money into Burnout Revenge.

I have no idea why a developer is telling us something else (much better performance), delays his game "to make it perfect" an the result is so bad.[/quote]
After reading that and the OXM review I'm very disheartened. The demo was ultra fun and I was looking forward to this game but I might as well rent it first based on said reviews.

God damn Denver...
There's always next year :(

Jollipop

Since 6886 Days

Wow that's crazy that they would release a game with those kind of problems.

In reply to

McErono

Since 6964 Days

maybe the demo 360 had problems (sound) but I played a lot on that 360 and had never problems with sound or framerates...

In reply to

Optimusv2

Since 6895 Days

McErono 5 fps for 30 seconds? I'm sorry i don't believe that at all. I'll see for myself when my copy from ebgames comes. If the demo as is has VERY minor slowdowns for me am I suppose to believe the final version of the game is as bad as your making it sound?

I just think this is a situation where you don't like the game at all and are just bad mouthing it to convince others that its bad as well.

I mean i'm basing this on the fact that I have played the xbox live demo and experienced very minor slowdowns while others were over dramatizing the slowdowns they were getting or something is wrong with their 360. I mean if there were differrent opinions on the demo then I also expect us to have different opinions on the final game.

In reply to

McErono

Since 6964 Days

man, have you forgotten who I am? again already?

I am the one that was defending fullauto on your side all the time... I don't like the game? I love the demo! Fact is that you have seen all with the demo and the retail doesn't add somthing else... same slowdowns (or even worse) strange thing is that the demo track is almost perfect on the retail (no more heavy slowdowns).

Have you or did I play the retail game? the thing with the 5fps happened once in an hour so don't judge the game by that, thats just a simple bug somewhere and wont happen all the time! normally you see slowdowns... the game gets slower, it is not stuttering like NFSMW but that 5fps thing happened... call my dealer mate if you don't believe it. Here's his website www.g-games.ch

If I wouldn't know it any better I'd say you have to be Cord Smith... Sorry for you but this game is nowhere worth 60bucks... never. I wont even rent it... I'm just waiting for a flawless burnout revenge. If you want to waste your money on unfinished and faulty software again... just do it and be happy with it. I simply wont buy any rushed software again... these developers have to learn that they have to make better games to earn their money.

In reply to

man, have you forgotten who I am? again already?

I am the one that was defending fullauto on your side all the time... I don't like the game? I love the demo! Fact is that you have seen all with the demo and the retail doesn't add somthing else... same slowdowns (or even worse) strange thing is that the demo track is almost perfect on the retail (no more heavy slowdowns).

Have you or did I play the retail game? the thing with the 5fps happened once in an hour so don't judge the game by that, thats just a simple bug somewhere and wont happen all the time! normally you see slowdowns... the game gets slower, it is not stuttering like NFSMW but that 5fps thing happened... call my dealer mate if you don't believe it. Here's his website www.g-games.ch

If I wouldn't know it any better I'd say you have to be Cord Smith... Sorry for you but this game is nowhere worth 60bucks... never. I wont even rent it... I'm just waiting for a flawless burnout revenge. If you want to waste your money on unfinished and faulty software again... just do it and be happy with it. I simply wont buy any rushed software again... these developers have to learn that they have to make better games to earn their money.

Jollipop

Since 6886 Days

Its expected for Optimusv2 to come in and damage control.

In reply to

SimonM7

Since 7026 Days

About the framerate issues, I've actually read reports that playing the game in 50hz destroys the framerate (for some reason). If the demo unit was running on an SDTV (or LCD with a standard scart/composite connection) that might've been the problem.

In reply to

An Elegant Tapestry of Aphorisms - The musings of a brilliant self proclaimed gaming philosopher.
http://aetoa.blogspot.com

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