Virtua Fighter 5 Preview(curse you Grift!)

GriftGFX

Since 7000 Days

Posted by kenshin2418

http://www.1up.com/do/reviewPage?cId=3157287

1UPs review

I love Milkman's disclaimer at the top :) Good stuff.

In reply to

kenshin2418

Since 6975 Days

Fortunately, VF5 doesn't succeed by throwing tons of superfluous Tekken-esque modes on a disc. It succeeds based on the merits of its infinitely replayable, highly finessed fighting engine. While "noobs" might be content to knit the same canned combos over and over, veterans will relish the ability to improvise, discover, and master new moves, combos, and strategies, day after day after day.

Tekken cheap shot taken :P

In reply to

This is my December

Acert93

Since 6971 Days

I know this is the wrong game, but VT3 and VF5 both used 6800GS hardware in the arcades, and are made by Sega... :P Soooo....

VT3 is 1080p, 2xMSAA, and 60fps.

Posted by SOL

I'll clear something up, VT3 Xbox 360 does run in 1080p natively and at 60fps. This is with 2xAA too

It's not like existing games which get upscaled when you choose 1080p in the Dash.

That is all
---
S0L
---

How does this apply? VF5 could very well be an excellent translation to the 360!

In reply to

Optimusv2 said: "Gun for the 360 has better graphics than both Halo 3 and Gears of War"

SilverHawk

Since 6618 Days

Posted by Acert93

How does this apply? VF5 could very well be an excellent translation to the 360!

I don't think this would surprise anyone, most people expect the 360 to be the definitive version anyway.

Personally I hope Sumo is doing the 360 version, as they know a thing or two about online play, and they also have more 360 experience at this point.

In reply to

GriftGFX

Since 7000 Days

Posted by SilverHawk

Personally I hope Sumo is doing the 360 version, as they know a thing or two about online play, and they also have more 360 experience at this point.

The 360 version most likely won't have online play, either. No amount of experience will make up for the fact that you just can't guarantee the level of latency required to keep the experience intact.

Hopefully they do include some internet functionality though--a home version of VF.tv would be a nice bonus.

In reply to

SilverHawk

Since 6618 Days

Posted by GriftGFX

The 360 version most likely won't have online play, either. No amount of experience will make up for the fact that you just can't guarantee the level of latency required to keep the experience intact.

Hopefully they do include some internet functionality though--a home version of VF.tv would be a nice bonus.

I know AM2 doesn't want online play because of the latency issue and the precise timing of VF5. But seriously GriftGFX, how hard could it be to set up dedicated servers for one of your biggest franchises. VF5 is a game that demands competition, how cool would it be to play all the top VF5 players across the world.

As a Sega fan, it pains me to see that after all this time they still don't get it :(

As for Sumo having more 360 experience, I was talking about their ability to do a great 360 conversion, since they already did VT3.

In reply to

kenshin2418

Since 6975 Days

Grift doesn't want online play, just mainly because he knows that he will have to play me, and I will bring that fire. He knows where he stands. Can't stop the team of Akira, Koga, and Jackie, aka, Evolution :)

Hibachi!

a VF.tv Live feature for the 360 version, would be a nice addition. I don't really see how that would be hard for them to implement. I'll give them the benefit of the doubt with online play, for now

In reply to

This is my December

GriftGFX

Since 7000 Days

Posted by SilverHawk

I know AM2 doesn't want online play because of the latency issue and the precise timing of VF5. But seriously GriftGFX, how hard could it be to set up dedicated servers for one of your biggest franchises. VF5 is a game that demands competition, how cool would it be to play all the top VF5 players across the world.

As a Sega fan, it pains me to see that after all this time they still don't get it :(

As for Sumo having more 360 experience, I was talking about their ability to do a great 360 conversion, since they already did VT3.

In order to guarantee no lag, you'd need ~15ms latency guarenteed. Most people can't sustain that even with a dedicated server. Is it possible? Sure, I ping 5-10ms to a lot of PC game servers, but I have an above average internet connection too. I wouldn't mind VF5 being online, but I do understand their concern, and I'm not too worked up about it.

Lets face it, there is one traditional online fighter (3D) right now--DOA--and that's it. And you'd be crazy to suggest that even that is a lag free experience. Mortal Kombat is online too--does that make it better than Virtua Fighter? Perhaps for the casual crowd...

As for Sumo, I do trust them to do a quality port, if that's what it comes down to. I think AM2 will do a fine job if they do it themselves though. I don't think it's really a matter of Sega not getting anything--if Tekken and Soul Calibur BOTH go online than perhaps they really are falling behind--but I would like to see some other well founded 3D fighters make that transition too.

DOA is the only reason people have to bitch about the lack of internet play, and it's a poor comparison, if you ask me. Comes with plenty of lag, too.

In reply to

[quote=SilverHawk]

I know AM2 doesn't want online play because of the latency issue and the precise timing of VF5. But seriously GriftGFX, how hard could it be to set up dedicated servers for one of your biggest franchises. VF5 is a game that demands competition, how cool would it be to play all the top VF5 players across the world.

As a Sega fan, it pains me to see that after all this time they still don't get it :(

As for Sumo having more 360 experience, I was talking about their ability to do a great 360 conversion, since they already did VT3.[/quote]

In order to guarantee no lag, you'd need ~15ms latency guarenteed.  Most people can't sustain that even with a dedicated server.  Is it possible?  Sure, I ping 5-10ms to a lot of PC game servers, but I have an above average internet connection too.  I wouldn't mind VF5 being online, but I do understand their concern, and I'm not too worked up about it.

Lets face it, there is one traditional online fighter (3D) right now--DOA--and that's it.  And you'd be crazy to suggest that even that is a lag free experience.  Mortal Kombat is online too--does that make it better than Virtua Fighter?  Perhaps for the casual crowd...

As for Sumo, I do trust them to do a quality port, if that's what it comes down to.  I think AM2 will do a fine job if they do it themselves though.  I don't think it's really a matter of Sega not getting anything--if Tekken and Soul Calibur [b]BOTH[/b] go online than perhaps they really are falling behind--but I would like to see some other well founded 3D fighters make that transition too.

DOA is the only reason people have to bitch about the lack of internet play, and it's a poor comparison, if you ask me.  Comes with plenty of lag, too.

Jollipop

Since 6883 Days

Well lag or not they should still try to impliment it.

DOA4 can be a nightmare to play sometimes online, but I dont' believe DOA4 uses servers it is P2P hosting isn't it ?

In reply to

Marumaro for the WIN !!

GriftGFX

Since 7000 Days

Posted by Jollipop

Well lag or not they should still try to impliment it.

DOA4 can be a nightmare to play sometimes online, but I dont' believe DOA4 uses servers it is P2P hosting isn't it ?

It is (P2P)--but then again, DOA doesn't have any moves that require a single frame precision--that's 1/60th of a second we're talking about.

I would love to see the series online in the future, I just don't expect it quite yet. Hopefully we'll see Namco move in that direction with Tekken and/or Soul Calibur. We shall see.

In reply to

SilverHawk

Since 6618 Days

Posted by Jollipop

Well lag or not they should still try to impliment it.

That's what I think too, so what if there is a little lag, it's never going to be perfect. Some online play is better than no online play IMO.

In reply to

kenshin2418

Since 6975 Days

Interesting, someone over at Gaf spotted this,

Just saw the VF5 commercial and I was totally expecting it to be a PS3 specific commercial this early in the game but at the end it said "coming soon for 360" and had the 360/LIVE logo along side the ps family logo. Wasnt this coming in like late august/early september? Is it coming sooner? Will it have live play? Its still February. Why have a spot in there for 360 6 months in advance?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z5K6PTc0h3I
the commercial, I've seen it on CN, but never noticed the 360 part at the end. Not saying it will have online play, but maybe some VF.tv Live integration, or something. Or just be BS :P

In reply to

This is my December

Jollipop

Since 6883 Days

Posted by GriftGFX

It is (P2P)--but then again, DOA doesn't have any moves that require a single frame precision--that's 1/60th of a second we're talking about.

I would love to see the series online in the future, I just don't expect it quite yet. Hopefully we'll see Namco move in that direction with Tekken and/or Soul Calibur. We shall see.

I think the whole 1/60th of a second thing is a lame excuse for not including online play, I dont' think it is that important to the game mechanics, sure lag would interfer with the gameplay but it does in DOA4 also. (it does in almost any game for that matter)

In reply to

Marumaro for the WIN !!

GriftGFX

Since 7000 Days

Posted by Jollipop

I think the whole 1/60th of a second thing is a lame excuse for not including online play, I dont' think it is that important to the game mechanics, sure lag would interfer with the gameplay but it does in DOA4 also. (it does in almost any game for that matter)

Well, it does matter. It's not so much an excuse as a legitimate reason, but whatever. DOA isn't even always truely playable online--and it has much looser frame windows--so if lag interferes with DOA's gameplay it stands to reason that it would be much worse in VF.

In reply to

Jollipop

Since 6883 Days

I don't see how it has a looser frame window.

Perhaps you need to go into more detail, obviously the moves aren't a 60th of a second in speed as that impossible, i guess you are talking timing here.

If timing was half the speed online then i don't see how that would make much difference as a human can barely see a 60th of a second let alone time a button press at that speed.

In reply to

Marumaro for the WIN !!

GriftGFX

Since 7000 Days

Frames are used to calculate/measure timing for fighting games. I'm not suggesting that every situation requires that much precision on the players part (although it can happen--and people can do it) but the gameplay is pretty demanding when it comes to timing and understanding timing. Technically, DOA is being timed on the same scale, but it's generally not as demanding. I'm thinking of a frame as more a measurement of time than a single image.

http://virtuafighter.com/view.php?section=vf4&file...

And when lag hits, all you can really do is slow everything down, which certainly impacts the gameplay. DOA's counters are a good example of how liberal its timing can get, and it's one of the reasons that it makes a good candidate for online play. I'm not sayin it's impossible just maybe not that practical--SF2/3 can both be pretty demanding with your timing too--and they're both online.

It may be possible to put VF online, but it would certainly play a lot differently with lag. I would still play it though, so I guess you're mostly right, they should try..and hopefully if the genre survives the next few years, we'll see more of that soon. It will be interesting to see if Namco decides to go online.

In reply to

Frames are used to calculate/measure timing for fighting games.  I'm not suggesting that every situation requires that much precision on the players part (although it can happen--and people can do it) but the gameplay is pretty demanding when it comes to timing and understanding timing.  Technically, DOA is being timed on the same scale, but it's generally not as demanding.  I'm thinking of a frame as more a measurement of time than a single image.

http://virtuafighter.com/view.php?section=vf4&file=vf4ft_frames_guide.html

And when lag hits, all you can really do is slow everything down, which certainly impacts the gameplay.  DOA's counters are a good example of how liberal its timing can get, and it's one of the reasons that it makes a good candidate for online play.  I'm not sayin it's impossible just maybe not that practical--SF2/3 can both be pretty demanding with your timing too--and they're both online.

It may be possible to put VF online, but it would certainly play a lot differently with lag.  I would still play it though, so I guess you're mostly right, they should try..and hopefully if the genre survives the next few years, we'll see more of that soon.  It will be interesting to see if Namco decides to go online.

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