Thx blim, downloadan now. Thought u werent allowed to post anything for a couple of weeks?

oooooh finally I get to see the E46 M3 in the game. I've been waiting forever for someone to capture it. Can't wait to see the cockpit.

MS gave blim the green light.

kick ass! I'm so hyped for this game. Thanks, Blim.

Best looking racing game on the market, as they said at E3? No, not even near...

But the demo was promising, so I will surely enjoy the game anyway.

I'd rather inconsistent graphics and a perfect framerate than perfect graphics and an inconsistent framerate.

Fenrir: I never say i didn't. My point is how stupid their statements have been about Forza 3. Why say at E3 that Forza 3 has the best graphics when Dirt 2 was playable there and looked far better? ;)

Dirt 2 is a rally game that runs at 30fps.....

Every company markets their game with hype. They're not going to say "eh, it's not quite as realistically lit as GTP5 and not quite as good as Dirt", are they? Be real.

Personally I prefer the cleaner look of F3 to the poorer car modelling and blurry lighting effects with 30FPS on Dirt. Not forgetting the amount going on under the hood and both games are there for completely different reasons. Both look great though.

You have to take all things into consideration.... on the surface, Dirt2 can be prettier in some aspects, but I'd dare say that a LOT more went into the overall Forza3 experience than what you get with Dirt2.

If half of the dev time that went into physics, aaaaaall of the different cars, customization, etc. was put simply into graphics alone, this game would be off the charts.

Since everyone seems to miss the whole point I end the discussion right now ;)

I see that Blim is not the drifter.
I love the Kaido Track.
Amazing game can’t wait.
And IMO it does look better than the brownish mud Dirt2 is.

Yes, it's everyone else missing the point and not you. :P

@squarejawhero: Uhm, actually yes, everyone IS missing his point. Nepton is talking about the Turn 10 comment at E3 that Forza 3 will be the best looking racing game on the market. I think we all can agree that it's not. The point that Nepton was trying to make was not about Forza 3 as a game, but about the graphics comment.

So, what does this have to do with physics, all the different cars and customization that zomfg was bringing up? Nothing, i would say. And about the marketing talk that you were bringing up. To promote your own game you don't have to mention other games, do you? Hell, why even mention that your game will be the best looking racing game, when it's just not true.

I understand the logic and philosophy about marketing and pr, and nepton probably as well, but Turn 10 just lied, and lying like that is not my cup of tea. Let your game speak for itself and deliver quality. So, yes, it's everyone else that was missing the point, not nepton.

I cant register at Neogaf but saw that you wrote "Any video requests by the way?" And YES. Been searching for weeks for a Forza 3 split screen video. No one has done it yet! Please?

I never said that I was refuting his comment about Turn 10. I was speaking about judging the game in general. Turn 10's comment about the graphics is not going to affect how I play the game, is it? Also, art is completely SUBJECTIVE, and therefore you can't judge what Turn 10 said as a "lie". There are people who will say they think it's the best looking. There is no factual basis on "what looks better". There just isn't. It's subjective. You can get into technicalities, shaders, anti-aliasing, blablabla but in the end, those things aren't going to save an overall GAME.

And thus, I'm saying that to merely compare the graphics between Forza and Dirt2 when there is much more at stake here, would be silly. And it is. With the amount that was put into other resources for Forza3, they could have easily skipped those things to make sure that the game was simply as pretty as it could be, but there's more to the overall package.

I didn't miss any point. I'm simply making my own point.

Btw, there are 2 things i noticed about the cockpit view in Forza 3. Why can't i see the whole rearview mirror in these video's. Is that just me?

Also, when you're in cockpit view and you're looking behind you, then why is the camera suddenly outside of the car at the back? As if you're not INSIDE of the car anymore. Am i just doing something wrong or is it supposed to be like this? Not that it matters THAT much, but it feels like a tiny immersion breaker.

I don't like lying in marketing either, but the sad fact it does happen, and it happens really, really often. And frankly, yes, it's subjective, and I believe for what it does (actual tire deformation? o_0) and how it looks it is, arguably (important - not necessarily my opinion), the best looking racing game - and here's the important part - on the market.

That includes Dirt, which I also think looks great. However neither looks quite as nice as a rainy night in Shanghai in the sadly maligned PGR4.

That's not lying, frankly, and saying so reeks of picking corners. So, no, I don't agree, and by the looks of things neither does anyone else. GT5 will up the stakes next year and will take the mantle.

Personally I'll judge the project not the marketing itself.

@zomfg: So to be clear, you are countering nepton's comment by saying that people shouldn't judge the "overall GAME" just by graphics alone? Isn't that just weird? I mean, where was anyone in the above comments judging the game by it's graphics? Hell, nepton even said that the demo was promising and that he'll enjoy the game.

Seriously, this really makes me think you DID miss the point. And if you didn't, than you sure have a weird way of discussing things.

Btw, there actually IS factual basis on what looks "better". Like you said, the factual basis should be modelling, shaders, anti-aliasing and stuff. What you probably mean is that there is no factual basis on what looks "prettier", cause THAT'S subjective.

Better is based on facts, prettier is based on preference.

Hello, I was not referring to him. I already said that. Squarejawhero made a comment and I responded to his comment, which was comparing Forza to Dirt. He started talking about tire deformation, 30fps, etc. I said that I feel that there's more to the overall package with Forza than Dirt offers, so that outweights how "pretty" it looks. That was me saying my opinion. It has nothing to do with the Turn 10 comment.

Also, what "looks better" is NOT factual. There are people who like to listen to 80's death metal that sounds like it was recorded on a tape recorder, because they think that new metal sounds over-produced in a multi-million dollar studio. Which one "sounds better"? It depends on what you're listening for and what you like. The same goes with visuals.

One person may care more about less jaggies, lighting, or textures. Somebody else may care more about the track design, etc. There is no flat BETTER or WORSE. There are too many elements to consider. Thus, it's based on OPINION and you can not say that Turn 10 are lying when they say they'll have the best game out. Secondly, GT5 is not going to be out at the same time when Forza releases, so it doesn't compete for that title at the moment, and Dirt is not even the same type of racing game that Forza is, so it's irrelevant at this point. They can very easily claim that they have the best looking game out, when you consider more than just what's on the surface. They could just make a drop-dead-gorgeous tech demo that looks better than the competition out there, but then you have to craft it into an entire experience, which is what I think Forza3 will do over Dirt2.

I have no idea why you're getting all uppity like I was attacking the other guy for commenting on Turn 10. I understood what he, and you, have said completely, but I disagree.

Hey, stop writing you guys. You are making my split screen video request invisible :P

@zomfg: Sorry, my bad! I thought your comment was meant for nepton.

But about "better" or "prettier", we just gonna have to disagree, but that's ok

I’m not the drifter as well but I think it should be rather „easy“ when traction and stability control is switched off.
That said I only played the demo and I still haven’t got my Porsche Wheel…
I meant no offence it was just rather funny to watch the drift track without drifts. Good driving none the less.I do not agree with you. FM3 is IMO the best looking racing game on the market. You may speak for yourself but please don’t speak for me.

@edwindows and nepton- You're still both over reacting about a stupid marketing line from E3. MANY other developers say the same type of things about their games when they're marketing them. Squarejawhero already answered your point and the conversation should've ended there:Do you play other racing games? Out of all the ones with cockpit views that I've played the last few years (PGR,Test Drive,GT:P,Shift,Dirt,etc) all of them except one had the same "rear bumper" look behind view.