Shenmue II live replay

Commented on 2015-07-01 10:48:56

The graphics and attention to detail in the Shenmue games were ahead of their time. Way better than anything PS2 had.

It's sad how the Dreamcast didn't sell more when it had some of the best console games ever made in it's short life. It took the PS2 more than twice as long to even get close to the amount of classics DC had in it's library. Just shows that great games don't necessarily sell a console. PR, brand name, hype and public stupidity often win out.

In reply to

Driftwood

Commented on 2015-07-01 10:51:21 In reply to NoClipMode

Don't forget SEGA's total incompetence. Sadly, that's a reason a lot of people seem to forget, it's not all Sony's and stupid people's fault as you claim.

In reply to

KORNdog

Commented on 2015-07-01 10:53:20 In reply to NoClipMode

Posted by NoClipMode

The graphics and attention to detail in the Shenmue games were ahead of their time. Way better than anything PS2 had.

It's sad how the Dreamcast didn't sell more when it had some of the best console games ever made in it's short life. It took the PS2 more than twice as long to even get close to the amount of classics DC had in it's library. Just shows that great games don't necessarily sell a console. PR, brand name, hype and public stupidity often win out.

not to mentioned the dreamcast loosing any and all third party support lol. it made the decision pretty easy, even for the "stupid public", haha

In reply to

Loneck

Commented on 2015-07-01 13:21:54 In reply to KORNdog

Posted by KORNdog

not to mentioned the dreamcast loosing any and all third party support lol. it made the decision pretty easy, even for the "stupid public", haha

That is not true, third party support was quite good I would say but EA did not support the DC. Anyway thx for the video, the part with the missing heads was funny :)

In reply to

KORNdog

Commented on 2015-07-01 13:36:37 In reply to Loneck

Posted by Loneck

That is not true, third party support was quite good I would say but EA did not support the DC. Anyway thx for the video, the part with the missing heads was funny :)

losing EA is pretty massive in the third party space. not to mention the domino effect they're capable of causing lol. they're not exactly a small developer/publisher. if you don't have all the third party big guns your console will fail (see most nintendo consoles post SNES)

In reply to

Loneck

Commented on 2015-07-01 14:11:53

Yeah but Visual Concept replaced EA equally at least with regards to sports games. I think main problem was that Sega's reputation was highly damaged by Mega-CD, 32X and Saturn. But hats down to some developers what they could do with Saturn (some called it abortion) with titles like Exhumed/Powerslave, Sega Rally and Panzer Dragoon series especially Panzer Dragoon Saga which is dynamite.

In reply to

KORNdog

Commented on 2015-07-01 14:28:15 In reply to Loneck

Posted by Loneck

Yeah but Visual Concept replaced EA equally at least with regards to sports games.

in terms of there just being sports game, sure. but it's kind of ignoring important aspects like popularity and quality. it's like if call of duty wasn't on a system and saying duke nukem forever was an equal replacement. lol

In reply to

jeenyus

Commented on 2015-07-01 16:31:00

"ahead of its time" the most overrated line used by rabid DC fanboys.

Post 1 good game anywhere and see the undeserved console praise instead of the developer praise. The DC was one of the biggest console failures, it had mostly arcade ports (good ones tho') and few notable titles. It gained popularity after its death mostly through piracy as you can run a copied disc w/o any HW/FW mod.

In reply to

SplitTongue

Commented on 2015-07-01 23:36:05 In reply to jeenyus

Yes, it was ahead of it's time, just like the NeoGeo was ahead of it's time if you compare them to their respective competitors at that time. Besides, how many consoles do you know of that have or had online play, keyboard support or an internet browser back then or even today ? Name a few just so i can have a laugh. Or name a few games with motion control (Sega Bass Fishing), voice control (Seaman) or voice chat (Alien Front) from any competitor ? And there was the VMU's too, just a gimmick but still...You must be one of them ignorant pirates i guess.

In reply to

DoctorFouad

Commented on 2015-07-02 00:08:05

Nostalgia ! Shenmue for me is simply the best video game ever created PERIOD congratulations yu suzuki ! the game was so ahead of its time and pioneered/invented many of the gameplay/story telling mechanics that we take for granted today and that now are considered mainstream.

And yes agree with those who said Dreamcast was ahead of its time, indeed the MAIN reason dreamcast failed is exactly that : it was TOO MUCH AHEAD of its time in terms of timing of release. Hell, it was released fall 1998 exactly the same periodof release of gran turismo, final fantasy8, MGS1, Zelda ocarina of time....

Had Sega better prepared the release of the dreamcast in fall 1999 instead of fall 1998, I believe the sort of the dreamcast would have been different....

Dreamcast is one of the best consoles in history, and unfortunately video games changed dramatically to the worst after dreamcast commercial failure...they became less fun....less inovative....

In reply to

SplitTongue

Commented on 2015-07-02 00:35:20

Now that i think of the NeoGeo... Man, I really would like to see the demoscene make something AWESOME out of a NeoGeo.

In reply to

jeenyus

Commented on 2015-07-02 01:07:38 In reply to SplitTongue

^^ LOL, you're just supporting what I said, except the part where you mention DC being great by failing, WTF. No need to bring that horror Seaman game.

As for NeoGeo I assume this was known:
http://www.ngdevdirect.com/

In reply to

Akumajo

Commented on 2015-07-02 02:52:42 In reply to NoClipMode

Posted by NoClipMode

The graphics and attention to detail in the Shenmue games were ahead of their time. Way better than anything PS2 had.

It's sad how the Dreamcast didn't sell more when it had some of the best console games ever made in it's short life. It took the PS2 more than twice as long to even get close to the amount of classics DC had in it's library. Just shows that great games don't necessarily sell a console. PR, brand name, hype and public stupidity often win out.

Shenmue also started out as a Sega Saturn project and had a huge budget.

Sega did use elements of Shenmue to make Ryu Go Gotoku aka Yakuza which were very good sellers in PlayStation 2 in Japan and later in PlayStation 3 in Japan and even was given I believe two known games on PlayStation 4.

On PS3 Yakuza surpassed Shenmue hands down.

However note that besides Sega's bleeding money from Sega CD, 32X and Saturn in North America and Europe regions as well as mismanagement and poorly relying on game magazines instead of maintaining their own Sega Visions magazine (bear in mind the Saturn and DC had like four or five magazines in Japan) the reason you may not have been able to see Shenmue replicated on PlayStation 2 is ONLY because of investing the budget which Sega could not do and GTA series was taking the mind share away from in a completely different genre.

In reply to

[quote=NoClipMode]The graphics and attention to detail in the Shenmue games were ahead of their time. Way better than anything PS2 had.

It's sad how the Dreamcast didn't sell more when it had some of the best console games ever made in it's short life. It took the PS2 more than twice as long to even get close to the amount of classics DC had in it's library. Just shows that great games don't necessarily sell a console. PR, brand name, hype and public stupidity often win out.[/quote]

Shenmue also started out as a Sega Saturn project and had a huge budget.

Sega did use elements of Shenmue to make Ryu Go Gotoku aka Yakuza which were very good sellers in PlayStation 2 in Japan and later in PlayStation 3 in Japan and even was given I believe two known games on PlayStation 4.

On PS3 Yakuza surpassed Shenmue hands down.

However note that besides Sega's bleeding money from Sega CD, 32X and Saturn in North America and Europe regions as well as mismanagement and poorly relying on game magazines instead of maintaining their own Sega Visions magazine (bear in mind the Saturn and DC had like four or five magazines in Japan) the reason you may not have been able to see Shenmue replicated on PlayStation 2 is ONLY because of investing the budget which Sega could not do and GTA series was taking the mind share away from in a completely different genre.

SplitTongue

Commented on 2015-07-02 04:41:57 In reply to jeenyus

I don't see how i am supporting what you said, none of the mentioned 'features' were developed 3rd party (except Seaman i think) but inhouse at Sega. You played it first on DC, so yes, DC should take credit for it. As for the NeoGeo, check out what Elix did on SNES with their demo 'Smash it'. I'd like to see the scene bake something similar on the NG.

In reply to

Megido

Commented on 2015-07-02 08:14:29

I like the DC. Got it on launch and everything. But i dont get this "best console ever" thing. Over hyped as fuck ithink :)

In reply to

SplitTongue

Commented on 2015-07-02 13:56:50

"ahead of its time" yes of course, "best console ever" nah never, games were not that good to call it that. I can't remember a single 90+ review.

In reply to

Doom_Bringer

Commented on 2015-07-02 17:53:56

the game looks really clean! Minimal jaggies

i want a HD port on PS4

In reply to

NoClipMode

Commented on 2015-07-03 19:39:09 In reply to Driftwood

What incompetence did Sega have? They made extremely high quality games and the console had innovative features. The main reason the DC eventually failed is because of the Sony hype train. Almost everyone was waiting for the super hyped up PS2. Then when PS2 came out, for the first year it had almost no great games and the launch line-up was truly pathetic. DC's games library at the time was SO much better it was laughable.

So yes, it was partly down to stupid people. After the failure of the Saturn, Sega also didn't have the money for advertising or much else, yet still produced a superior console and games.

In reply to

Driftwood

Commented on 2015-07-03 21:28:47 In reply to NoClipMode

Whatever works for you. They started digging their own grave when conceiving the Saturn, thinking building a console which was not 3d centric was the way to go. The architecture of the console made it very difficult for the developers to make games, that's why they lost, not because of people or Sony.

The Saturn did have great 3d games though, as even Tomb Raider was first released on Sega's console, and almost every PlayStation exclusive had a worthy Saturn exclusive. It was not enough to win, and that's why they lost a lot of money even before the Dreamcast arrived.

So in the end, blame whoever you want but the bottom line is Sega didn't deal with the situation as they should have and it is no wonder their main competitor beat them. I bought a Dreamcast and was truly happy with it (which is why I still have it at home) but Sega was already done for when it was released. The money they invested in Shenmue was the fatal blow they could not recover from. Of course the fact that Sony had people hyped for their consoles had also something to do in Sega's failure, but it's business right?

In reply to

Whatever works for you. They started digging their own grave when conceiving the Saturn, thinking building a console which was not 3d centric was the way to go. The architecture of the console made it very difficult for the developers to make games, that's why they lost, not because of people or Sony.

The Saturn did have great 3d games though, as even Tomb Raider was first released on Sega's console, and almost every PlayStation exclusive had a worthy Saturn exclusive. It was not enough to win, and that's why they lost a lot of money even before the Dreamcast arrived.

So in the end, blame whoever you want but the bottom line is Sega didn't deal with the situation as they should have and it is no wonder their main competitor beat them. I bought a Dreamcast and was truly happy with it (which is why I still have it at home) but Sega was already done for when it was released. The money they invested in Shenmue was the fatal blow they could not recover from. Of course the fact that Sony had people hyped for their consoles had also something to do in Sega's failure, but it's business right?

Janman

Commented on 2015-07-04 00:23:46

Megido and SplitTongue:
It is totally fine to say that Dreamcast is the best console ever. Of course not everyone agrees and that is Ok too. The cold way would be looking at review scores and judging by those. Console may have fewer "top rated" games and still be considered the best, if those were the most impacting games for you personally.

I also think that the best console ever would have to be one of Sega's consoles.

My favorites from Dreamcast era:
Blue Stinger, Crazy Taxi, Ecco the Dolphin: Defender of the Future, F355 Challenge, Fur Fighters, Headhunter, Hidden & Dangerous, Jet Set Radio, Metropolis Street Racer, Nomad Soul, Resident Evil: Code Veronica, Sega Rally 2, Shadowman, Shenmue 1&2, Skies of Arcadia, Sonic Adventure, Soul Calibur, Speed Devils, Tokyo Highway Challenge 2, Toy Commander, Urban Chaos.

In reply to

timotim

Commented on 2015-07-04 06:15:20 In reply to SplitTongue

Posted by SplitTongue

"ahead of its time" yes of course, "best console ever" nah never, games were not that good to call it that. I can't remember a single 90+ review.

You cant be serious.
NFL2K
NBA2K1
Soul Calibur
Jet Grind Radio
Shenmue

Tons of classics on DC

In reply to

SplitTongue

Commented on 2015-07-04 13:04:32 In reply to timotim

Like i said, none of those received 90+ in any german mag that i read at that time, those were somewhere in the 85-90% range which was outrageous if you ask me, like there was a widespread disfavour among editors because "Well, its neiter Nintendo nor Sony, so... NO!"

PS: I have around 90 legal copies for my DC (not a single 2nd hand purchase), around 25 of those are japan or US imports. Not my fault Sega went broke.

In reply to

newbielives

Commented on 2015-07-04 18:34:08 In reply to Akumajo

Its funny i always thought the yakuza team would make shenmue3

-shenmue3 backer-

Posted by Akumajo

Shenmue also started out as a Sega Saturn project and had a huge budget.

Sega did use elements of Shenmue to make Ryu Go Gotoku aka Yakuza which were very good sellers in PlayStation 2 in Japan and later in PlayStation 3 in Japan and even was given I believe two known games on PlayStation 4.

On PS3 Yakuza surpassed Shenmue hands down.

However note that besides Sega's bleeding money from Sega CD, 32X and Saturn in North America and Europe regions as well as mismanagement and poorly relying on game magazines instead of maintaining their own Sega Visions magazine (bear in mind the Saturn and DC had like four or five magazines in Japan) the reason you may not have been able to see Shenmue replicated on PlayStation 2 is ONLY because of investing the budget which Sega could not do and GTA series was taking the mind share away from in a completely different genre.

In reply to

Megido

Commented on 2015-07-04 20:46:37 In reply to newbielives

Posted by newbielives

Its funny i always thought the yakuza team would make shenmue3

-shenmue3 backer-

Kinda happy that they just get to keep making Yakuza, as i think Yakuza is a much better series of games :P

In reply to

newbielives

Commented on 2015-07-06 23:15:13 In reply to Megido

I love both games, not sure i could pick one over the other, although yakuza is more stream line with more action i feel shenmue is still more immersive

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Shenmue II live replay

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