Battlefield 3 -- Now with *less* suppression! - Main forum

Since 7013 Days

Hey whatever you like, I guess. I've watched my console gamer friends play PC games and lose themselves in the keyboard. It's difficult to watch. I think the worst thing I've ever witnessed (I mean, gaming, it doesn't compare to 9/11 or anything) was my buddy playing L4D2 for PC.. on his Mac.. with an Xbox pad. Noob to the noob power. It's a bit like riding around in a wheel chair when you could be walking.. because it feels better.

I don't think better is subjective in this case though. Not even close. Mouse-look alone is enough to make it a demonstrable upgrade. So are using eight-to-ten digits for input and a controller with (many) more buttons. You may feel more comfortable with the pad, but the keyboard and mouse is objectively better. The only advantage the other side of this discussion has is analog movement, and I've yet to play an FPS where that actually matters.

But ultimately it all comes down to personal preference. Some people prefer to play Street Fighter with a SNES controller too. More power to them.

And speaking of inputs: I wonder what kind of flight stick support this will have.

Posted by Frozpot

Bolt cutters... Some kind of sabotage? Maybe you can lock doors or vehicles...

Who knows.. but it sure does seem like.. something. I don't think they'd throw those in there are decoration, but I guess that's possible too.

In reply to

Hey whatever you like, I guess. I've watched my console gamer friends play PC games and lose themselves in the keyboard. It's difficult to watch. I think the worst thing I've ever witnessed (I mean, gaming, it doesn't compare to 9/11 or anything) was my buddy playing L4D2 for PC.. on his Mac.. with an Xbox pad. Noob to the noob power. It's a bit like riding around in a wheel chair when you could be walking.. because it feels better.

I don't think better is subjective in this case though. Not even close. Mouse-look alone is enough to make it a demonstrable upgrade. So are using eight-to-ten digits for input and a controller with (many) more buttons. You may feel more comfortable with the pad, but the keyboard and mouse is objectively better. The only advantage the other side of this discussion has is analog movement, and I've yet to play an FPS where that actually matters.

But ultimately it all comes down to personal preference. Some people prefer to play Street Fighter with a SNES controller too. More power to them.

And speaking of inputs: I wonder what kind of flight stick support this will have.

[quote=Frozpot]Bolt cutters... Some kind of sabotage?  Maybe you can lock doors or vehicles...[/quote]

Who knows.. but it sure does seem like.. something. I don't think they'd throw those in there are decoration, but I guess that's possible too.

GriftGFX

Since 7013 Days

I seriously hope BF3 does this too.

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GriftGFX

Since 7013 Days

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F-KNLTMwSh8&feature...

^^ classic BF2 video

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ManThatYouFear

Since 6956 Days

i am actually quite excited about this, never played one.. but for some reason i am excited..

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PSN:ManThatYouFear
Santa better bring me what i want...

dcdelgado

Since 6873 Days

Never played one either, but will give this one a go on the 360 if it turns out to be a great game.

In reply to

** Yes We CAN!! **

Frozpot

Since 6771 Days

I think immersion is a pretty important factor, and feel is a big factor of that. For me at least. Mouse look is superior for aiming, I'll give you that, but I game less for the "sport" of gaming and more for the "being there". That's why suspension of disbelief is so important to me. Having used a number of these weapons in real situations, I actually get weirded out by the uber-accuracy. Another reason the dolphin dive/bunny hop give me indigestion. I "buy" the feel better with a pad, that's all. I also like the analogue movement and accessibility of the buttons. I always feel like I'm doing finger-gymnastics on the PC. I still find myself hitting the wrong buttons even though I have no problem typing. It's a strange disconnect that I can't explain well.
Of course, I also can't NOT use the M&K while playing on PC. It feels weird using a controller in that environment. So, at the end of the day, I will be playing BF3, on the PC, with M&K, LOL....

In reply to

Oooh, Profound, isn't it?

blmbox

Since 6344 Days

The Executive Producer of Dead Space 2 saw a live demonstration of BF3. On his Twitter acount he said it was 'incredible', and when asked if it blows away what's been showed in the GI issue he said 'yes'.

Sounds like we need to see this bad boy in motion.

In reply to

GriftGFX

Since 7013 Days

Posted by Frozpot

I always feel like I'm doing finger-gymnastics on the PC.

That's you not actually being used to it. After a while that all becomes muscle memory (just like typing, or, using a game pad). I actually think that probably has an enormous impact on your ability to feel the same level of "immersion." For me, using a pointer makes everything far more intuitive, and really seems more.. er.. immersible? The keyboard is clearly a barrier for you. After a while, switching weapons, reloading, or movement or whatever will just become second nature. You won't think, "I have to reload, so lets hit R!"--Your body will just do it.

Your ability to buy the feel of a pad is one thing, but I don't actually think that it's any better at simulating real live action. Oh, it has triggers! But you have to aim with this tiny joystick in ridiculously mechanical ways. Which is so laborious and slow that it has to be soaked in auto-aim to even "feel" right. ;)

Console users should check out FPS Freeks too. They really improve the feel of the joystick for aiming for me tremendously. It won't magically make you a better player but it does allow you to control higher sensitivities with more accuracy.

In reply to

[quote=Frozpot]I always feel like I'm doing finger-gymnastics on the PC. [/quote]

That's you not actually being used to it. After a while that all becomes muscle memory (just like typing, or, using a game pad). I actually think that probably has an enormous impact on your ability to feel the same level of "immersion." For me, using a pointer makes everything far more intuitive, and really seems more.. er.. immersible? The keyboard is clearly a barrier for you. After a while, switching weapons, reloading, or movement or whatever will just become second nature. You won't think, "I have to reload, so lets hit R!"--Your body will just do it.

Your ability to buy the feel of a pad is one thing, but I don't actually think that it's any better at simulating real live action. Oh, it has triggers! But you have to aim with this tiny joystick in ridiculously mechanical ways. Which is so laborious and slow that it has to be soaked in auto-aim to even "feel" right. ;)

Console users should check out FPS Freeks too. They really improve the feel of the joystick for aiming for me tremendously. It won't magically make you a better player but it does allow you to control higher sensitivities with more accuracy.

Frozpot

Since 6771 Days

Posted by GriftGFX

Your ability to buy the feel of a pad is one thing, but I don't actually think that it's any better at simulating real live action. Oh, it has triggers! But you have to aim with this tiny joystick in ridiculously mechanical ways. Which is so laborious and slow that it has to be soaked in auto-aim to even "feel" right. ;)

I'm not talking about it feeling like a weapon (silly notion) but that while you are shooting the real deal, you don't have some kind of uber-accurate knowledge of where you are aiming with extremely fine ability to adjust at insane speeds (unless you're talking mega-sharphooters- which I'm not, I actually shoot just under "expert"). That's kinda what I mean by "too-accurate"...

In reply to

Oooh, Profound, isn't it?

GriftGFX

Since 7013 Days

Posted by Frozpot

I'm not talking about it feeling like a weapon (silly notion) but that while you are shooting the real deal, you don't have some kind of uber-accurate knowledge of where you are aiming with extremely fine ability to adjust at insane speeds (unless you're talking mega-sharphooters- which I'm not, I actually shoot just under "expert"). That's kinda what I mean by "too-accurate"...

I'm not a military dude but I've handled fire arms. I'm not convinced that analog joysticks are any more representative of that experience. I'm actually convinced of the opposite. Point and shoot is a lot easier when you're using a controller that was designed to point in the first place :)

The camera isn't just your iron sights after all, it's your eyes and head movement too. I can move those things pretty quickly and accurately in real life. And granted, a rifle is harder to control than my own head, but not like.. a lot harder :P

In reply to

Frozpot

Since 6771 Days

Posted by GriftGFX

I'm not a military dude but I've handled fire arms. I'm not convinced that analog joysticks are any more representative of that experience. I'm actually convinced of the opposite. Point and shoot is a lot easier when you're using a controller that was designed to point in the first place :)

The camera isn't just your iron sights after all, it's your eyes and head movement too. I can move those things pretty quickly and accurately in real life. And granted, a rifle is harder to control than my own head, but not like.. a lot harder :P

Yeah, but to accurate though? Easier yes. It's hard to explain. It's also moving as while trying to shoot in a chaotic environment- All things I think BC2 really nails well, barring some strange delays in action. Regardless, that's my experience and take. I'm not trying to change your mind, lol. I enjoyed Crysis quite a bit on the 'ol M&K, I'm sure I will love BF3 as well...

In reply to

Oooh, Profound, isn't it?

JMadden

Since 5033 Days

Posted by Tomarru

BF2 jets > everything put together, helos > most things in the ground. You play BF2 now, you'll be raped by jets 99% of the time because they can slow to a crawl, can take out AA easier than it can take them out, can repair in flight and have more armaments than anything else.

Even BFBC2 helos are pretty insane, a decent pilot and gunner can get a dozen kills easily before being taken out, and thats only if the enemy manages to get the AA for any amount of time without the helo noticing. You could always get lucky with a tracer dart, but chances are youll run out before you get a hit, or youll get killed first....or they have flares.

Point is, aircraft have always been overpowered, and there have always been too few ways to take them out.

Have you played BFBC2: Vietnam? The Hueys are so underpowered, you can only get five seconds of Ride of the Valkyries or Fortunate Son before you explode.

In reply to

Alba go bragh!

GriftGFX

Since 7013 Days

I think it's a little early to worry about air dominance or anti air. With jets coming back in I'm thinking heat seekers are likely to reappear.

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rayy

Since 6987 Days

Man I can't wait to see this on motion.

I litle bit offtopic but check this gameplay video of BC2 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WdEvGSY6fss

If that guy is not using a hack, he is a pro, and damm good one.

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JMadden

Since 5033 Days

That is insane.

In reply to

Alba go bragh!

GriftGFX

Since 7013 Days

This is what FPS games look like when you play them on PC ;)

ASSHOLE THIS IS WHAT RUINS BAD COMPANY 2 PEOPLE PLAYING THIS LIKE ITS MW2 HATE TO TELL YOU. IT ISNT! LEARN? TO PLAY RECON KIT!

What a tool. Most recons just sit in a corner and do nothing.

In reply to

GriftGFX

Since 7013 Days

That dude does some awesome shit. The bailing out of the helo and taking out the other one with C4 bit was too fuckin cool. Battlefield rules.

I need to get Vietnam still.

In reply to

rayy

Since 6987 Days

Yeah that part was great.

Also the part where he snipe the helo pilot got me like 0_0

That is some serious skill right there.

In reply to

Viginti_Tres

Since 6515 Days

Posted by GriftGFX

This is what FPS games look like when you play them on PC ;)

Except... everything is doable on consoles. ;)

The montage is pretty awesome. Haven't seen someone take down a chopper midair with TNT yet.

In reply to

scoobs0688

Since 5647 Days

Posted by Viginti_Tres

Except... everything is doable on consoles. ;)

The montage is pretty awesome. Haven't seen someone take down a chopper midair with TNT yet.

"everything"? No. Consoles cant handle 64 players for a number of reasons. Nor can they do SSAO @ 1080p 60fps. Nor can they handle the polygons that modern day cards can. False statement :)

In reply to

Currently playing: Bad Company 2(PC), Uncharted 2(PS3), Dead Space (PS3)

GriftGFX

Since 7013 Days

Posted by scoobs0688

"everything"? No. Consoles cant handle 64 players for a number of reasons. Nor can they do SSAO @ 1080p 60fps. Nor can they handle the polygons that modern day cards can. False statement :)

Uh, he's talking about the video, and we're talking about how the game is played.. not image quality and player count. I'd love to see someone play like that on a console.

I challenge someone to post a video of someone with that kind of aim and twitch reaction time on a gamepad. Sure, what you see in this video maybe possible on a pad, but it's not very common.. and you can't tell me that the best PC clip videos don't crush the best console clip videos ;)

In reply to

scoobs0688

Since 5647 Days

Posted by GriftGFX

Uh, he's talking about the video, and we're talking about how the game is played.. not image quality and player count. I'd love to see someone play like that on a console.

I challenge someone to post a video of someone with that kind of aim and twitch reaction time on a gamepad. Sure, what you see in this video maybe possible on a pad, but it's not very common.. and you can't tell me that the best PC clip videos don't crush the best console clip videos ;)

Welp thats what I get for not reading the whole page lol. Sry about that ;)

In reply to

Currently playing: Bad Company 2(PC), Uncharted 2(PS3), Dead Space (PS3)

Viginti_Tres

Since 6515 Days

I'm not going into a debate of whenever a kb/m is better to use than a controller. It's obvious.

From the time I used snipers with the ACOG on BC2 to do the gold stars I got a pretty good feeling of how far you can really go with a sniper. And even with my limited time I got some awesome streaks going with it.

And I'm not that great with it. I had someone play against me who was ripping faces with a sniper in close quarters. While players like him are rare they show how much you can push the gameplay on consoles.

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GriftGFX

Since 7013 Days

I like the red dot for quick scoping, but it's not really necessary and ruins the long range viability of the rifle. It's still pretty fun to do though.

In reply to

rayy

Since 6987 Days

Another video from the same guy http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WdEvGSY6fss

I lol at the chat box.

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