RESIDENT EVIL 5 Thread

Since 6998 Days

I've gotta say, I'm finding Sheva to be one of the better AI-controlled partners I've had. If you manage her inventory and weapons properly, she really doesn't mess up that often. I tend to let her carry most of the herbs/F-aid sprays as she's generally quicker at using them than I am, plus it frees up one of my hot-keys for 'nades or mines. I also let her carry the sniper rifle; she rarely gets a headshot with it, but she's almost guaranteed to kill most regular enemies in two shots. Plus, she's good for seeking out ammo and money and will hand over ammo she doesn't need.

I wouldn't want to play the game on veteran with her, but on normal, I'm quite impressed actually.

In reply to

"If we can hit that bull's-eye, the rest of the dominoes will fall like a house of cards...Checkmate." - Zapp Brannigan

Phaethon360

Since 6859 Days

I was fine with her until Chapter 4 where you get to the Temple with mirrors shining light through the maze. She'd never know when to avoid getting hit and would instantly heal herself instead of finding cover. Same thing happened when the enemies started toting guns which I wasn't fond of either. She flat out died on the Jill/Wesker boss fight and I had to have a buddy help me over live.

In reply to

Don't you know who I am? I'm the goddamned Banman.

Ronsauce

Since 6998 Days

In Chapter 4, I had her maybe get hit 3 times, and at least one of the times was because I was cutting it really close, so it wasn't necessarily her fault. The rest of the time, she usually found cover fairly well, and I was impressed that she went into different cover than me.

As for the Wesker/Jill fight, Sheva did get hit a lot during the second part of the battle, but to be fair, so did I.

I just think she's getting an unreasonable amount of flak considering she's not that bad as far as AI partners go. She's died less on me than Dom ever did in GoW, and she's infinitely more useful than the grossly over-hyped dog from Fable 2.

In reply to

"If we can hit that bull's-eye, the rest of the dominoes will fall like a house of cards...Checkmate." - Zapp Brannigan

Phaethon360

Since 6859 Days

The dog in Fable wasn't a liability either. As for Dom, he didn't become a liability for me - but I think I played that co-op through its entirety. Still, I rarely recall Dom actually dying. The AI in Gears picked themselves up after a while, and in Gears 2 came to your aid. For Capcom's first effort its not entirely terrible, but I still would've preferred having more options to communicate with her. A simple "stay" command would've done wonders.

In reply to

Don't you know who I am? I'm the goddamned Banman.

Jollipop

Since 6896 Days

Correct me if im wrong but if Dom dies doesn't he just respawn ?

Sheva dies and its game over.

A simple "stay" command would've done wonders.

Or a simple choice to start out alone, they could have easily changed the levels a bit for SP, ie different routes.

In reply to

Marumaro for the WIN !!

Ronsauce

Since 6998 Days

More options would have been good, but considering the lack of options, I still found Sheva to be better than the previously mentioned AI partners... so much so that the fact that she could die and could directly affect me and the status of our inventory didn't really bother me at all.

The AI in Gears picked themselves up after a while, and in Gears 2 came to your aid.

Did they pick themselves up? I could have sworn they stayed down unless they were saved, killed, or until an area was cleared out - all of which aren't representative of what the AI can actually do.

And I'm certain Sheva has come to my aid much more than Dom ever did. In fact, she has less than a 2-second average response time when I'm in need of assistance.

I just think it's ridiculous the amount of negative criticism Sheva is getting despite working as well, if not better than any other AI partners I've had.

In reply to

"If we can hit that bull's-eye, the rest of the dominoes will fall like a house of cards...Checkmate." - Zapp Brannigan

Tinks

Since 6942 Days

I blame racism

In reply to

Jollipop

Since 6896 Days

Posted by Ronsauce

I just think it's ridiculous the amount of negative criticism Sheva is getting despite working as well, if not better than any other AI partners I've had.

Well thats what is expected when you add co-op to a game that doesn't need it :D

In reply to

Marumaro for the WIN !!

dcdelgado

Since 6873 Days

No if Dom dies its also game over.

This game is great and coop along with the visuals are amazing!.

In reply to

** Yes We CAN!! **

Kaz Hirai - Sony

"We don't provide the 'easy to program for' console that [developers] want, because 'easy to program for' means that anybody will be able to take advantage of pretty much what the hardware can do" LOLOLOLOL!!

Viginti_Tres

Since 6515 Days

Posted by Jollipop

Well thats what is expected when you add co-op to a game that doesn't need it :D

Then there aren't any games that "need" Coop. I played the game without Coop, and honestly it's way less fun... Coop should be pretty much standard in a majority of these games...

In reply to

Jollipop

Since 6896 Days

Posted by Viginti_Tres

Then there aren't any games that "need" Coop. I played the game without Coop, and honestly it's way less fun... Coop should be pretty much standard in a majority of these games...

Well no your right, no game "needs" Coop, but i was mainly being sarcastic.

In reply to

Marumaro for the WIN !!

KORNdog

Since 6417 Days

Posted by Ronsauce

In Chapter 4, I had her maybe get hit 3 times, and at least one of the times was because I was cutting it really close, so it wasn't necessarily her fault. The rest of the time, she usually found cover fairly well, and I was impressed that she went into different cover than me.

As for the Wesker/Jill fight, Sheva did get hit a lot during the second part of the battle, but to be fair, so did I.

I just think she's getting an unreasonable amount of flak considering she's not that bad as far as AI partners go. She's died less on me than Dom ever did in GoW, and she's infinitely more useful than the grossly over-hyped dog from Fable 2.

i think the flak is deserved considering how much more vital she is compared to say gears of war or killzone, hell, even co-op focused games like army of two. unlike those games sheva works in the exact same way you do, from using health kits, herbs, ammo, chosing weapons etc. in games like gears of war the AI has infinate ammo (gears, army of two etc) and/or cannot be killed (killzone 2)

if sheva worked in the same way dom does in gears. her AI wouldnt be an issue since as you said, she BEHAVES moderately well in terms of cover and general combat smarts, but because they decided to give her her own little inventory she uses ammo and items at a rediculous rate and cant manage the items she holds. which is why i think it's getting a lot of flak, and rightly so.

if you design AI that is so integral to the experience as they did in RE5, they damn sure better get it right. and they didnt. and becasue they didnt i'd rather they'd have gone the general co-op route and simply made sheva an additional gun but not exactly vital to a situation.

In reply to

[quote=Ronsauce]In Chapter 4, I had her maybe get hit 3 times, and at least one of the times was because [i]I[/i] was cutting it really close, so it wasn't necessarily her fault.  The rest of the time, she usually found cover fairly well, and I was impressed that she went into different cover than me.

As for the [spoiler]Wesker/Jill[/spoiler] fight, Sheva did get hit a lot during the second part of the battle, but to be fair, so did I.

I just think she's getting an unreasonable amount of flak considering she's not that bad as far as AI partners go.  She's died less on me than Dom ever did in GoW, and she's infinitely more useful than the grossly over-hyped dog from Fable 2.[/quote]

i think the flak is deserved considering how much more vital she is compared to say gears of war or killzone, hell, even co-op focused games like army of two. unlike those games sheva works in the exact same way you do, from using health kits, herbs, ammo, chosing weapons etc. in games like gears of war the AI has infinate ammo (gears, army of two etc) and/or cannot be killed (killzone 2)

if sheva worked in the same way dom does in gears. her AI wouldnt be an issue since as you said, she BEHAVES moderately well in terms of cover and general combat smarts, but because they decided to give her her own little inventory she uses ammo and items at a rediculous rate and cant manage the items she holds. which is why i think it's getting a lot of flak, and rightly so.

if you design AI that is so integral to the experience as they did in RE5, they damn sure better get it right. and they didnt. and becasue they didnt i'd rather they'd have gone the general co-op route and simply made sheva an additional gun but not exactly vital to a situation.

Ronsauce

Since 6998 Days

Posted by KORNdog

in games like gears of war the AI has infinate ammo (gears, army of two etc) and/or cannot be killed (killzone 2)

I don't see that as a positive. It makes me care less about how the character is doing and ultimately leaves me thinking "why is he even here?"

but because they decided to give her her own little inventory she uses ammo and items at a rediculous rate and cant manage the items she holds. which is why i think it's getting a lot of flak, and rightly so.

See, I view managing her inventory as part of the game in SP. Don't want her using all the shotgun ammo? Don't give her a shotgun. Simple. As for her health usage, she's quite good about it. She'll use the smaller health items when necessary, and often attempts to heal both parties instead of just herself.

if you design AI that is so integral to the experience as they did in RE5, they damn sure better get it right. and they didnt

No, they actually did.

But I could see the same people who have trouble with the controls potentially having an issue with Sheva as she does require a few button presses here and there to manage.

In reply to

[quote=KORNdog]in games like gears of war the AI has infinate ammo (gears, army of two etc) and/or cannot be killed (killzone 2)[/quote]

I don't see that as a positive.  It makes me care less about how the character is doing and ultimately leaves me thinking "why is he even here?"

[quote]but because they decided to give her her own little inventory she uses ammo and items at a rediculous rate and cant manage the items she holds. which is why i think it's getting a lot of flak, and rightly so. [/quote]

See, I view managing her inventory as part of the game in SP.  Don't want her using all the shotgun ammo?  Don't give her a shotgun.  Simple.  As for her health usage, she's quite good about it.  She'll use the smaller health items when necessary, and often attempts to heal both parties instead of just herself.

[quote]if you design AI that is so integral to the experience as they did in RE5, they damn sure better get it right. and they didnt[/quote]

No, they actually did.

But I could see the same people who have trouble with the controls potentially having an issue with Sheva as she does require a few button presses here and there to manage.

"If we can hit that bull's-eye, the rest of the dominoes will fall like a house of cards...Checkmate." - Zapp Brannigan

Jin187

Since 6757 Days

Posted by Ronsauce

But I could see the same people who have trouble with the controls potentially having an issue with Sheva as she does require a few button presses here and there to manage.

Looks like the same suspects to me :)

Mind you, I cant really comment Sheva's A.I because i havent played the game outside of Coop yet. Either way, Sheva is FIT! So i cant see how anyone can complain!?

In reply to

Resident Evil 5 is the best looking game I have EVER seen!!

KORNdog

Since 6417 Days

Don't want her using all the shotgun ammo? Don't give her a shotgun

see, i'd see that as a bit of a stupid design flaw. she should be smart enough to assess a situation and decide on the best weapon for said situation. the fact most people are using sheva only as a pack mule speaks volumes to me.

In reply to

BLackHawkodst

Since 5899 Days

Whats with all the Sheva hate, she works just fine for me, i love this game it just gets better and better.

In reply to

Prepare To Drop!!

Tomarru

Since 6085 Days

I don't use sheva ONLY as a pack mule, mostly as one, but she has proven useful in combat, particularly with piercing weapons (the 2nd hadgun or the mp5). I think she performs quite well, manages health items, provides some extra fire support and can take care of herself. Yes, she isn't quite a perfect shot, she can chew through ammo and prehaps on vet it may prove to be a nuisance but over the course of the game i have found her wholly acceptable and generally much more useful than any other AI characters in any other game.

In reply to

Tinks

Since 6942 Days

Posted by KORNdog

Don't want her using all the shotgun ammo? Don't give her a shotgun

see, i'd see that as a bit of a stupid design flaw. she should be smart enough to assess a situation and decide on the best weapon for said situation. the fact most people are using sheva only as a pack mule speaks volumes to me.

Why don't you play it and form your own opinions

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Megido

Since 6338 Days

EDIT*
NM i was obviously like 3 pages too late

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El perro, el perro es mi corazón
El gato, el gato, el gato es no bueno
Cilantro es cantante
Cilantro es muy famoso
Cilantro es el hombre con el queso del diablo!

Jollipop

Since 6896 Days

Posted by Ronsauce

She'll use the smaller health items when necessary, and often attempts to heal both parties instead of just herself.

And the big problem here is that she wastes herbs because she doesn't combine them.

In reply to

Marumaro for the WIN !!

dcdelgado

Since 6873 Days

Have not had this much fun since GOW2! :)

In reply to

** Yes We CAN!! **

Kaz Hirai - Sony

"We don't provide the 'easy to program for' console that [developers] want, because 'easy to program for' means that anybody will be able to take advantage of pretty much what the hardware can do" LOLOLOLOL!!

Tomarru

Since 6085 Days

Actually, she does combine herbs, i rarely do yet have a stack of G+G's and G+R's, i don't rmember her using many herbs that weren't combinations.
Almost finished the game (gonna finish it tonight), can't wait to unlock the unlimited ammo and go through again, theres so many things to unlock, i think its gonna take quite a while to achieve.

In reply to

KORNdog

Since 6417 Days

Posted by Tinks

Why don't you play it and form your own opinions

i will. but things like controls, inventroy and sheva's AI where pefectly guagable using the demo. sure i cant comment on things like story, character, set peices or bosses. but the chance of those things being an issue are slim anyway, the problems i have with the game are those that where present in the demo and are still present in the game.

In reply to

Ronsauce

Since 6998 Days

Posted by KORNdog

see, i'd see that as a bit of a stupid design flaw. she should be smart enough to assess a situation and decide on the best weapon for said situation. the fact most people are using sheva only as a pack mule speaks volumes to me.

Well, she does use the best weapon for the situation. She'll use the sniper rifle at long range and switch to whatever she has that's more suitable at shorter ranges. She'll use 'nades as well and hasn't inadvertently hit me with any of them. She's also quite adept at using the knife too. Also, considering so many players don't seem smart enough to effectively manage her inventory or hell, don't seem smart enough to acclimate themselves to not being able to shoot while moving, it almost seems unreasonable to expect Sheva to be much better than she is.

Posted by Jollipop

And the big problem here is that she wastes herbs because she doesn't combine them.

Someone already mentioned that this is incorrect. She does mix them. She doesn't anticipate that she might be picking up a red herb...and so won't save herbs, but she still uses them effectively.

In reply to

[quote=KORNdog]see, i'd see that as a bit of a stupid design flaw. she should be smart enough to assess a situation and decide on the best weapon for said situation. the fact most people are using sheva only as a pack mule speaks volumes to me.[/quote]

Well, she does use the best weapon for the situation.  She'll use the sniper rifle at long range and switch to whatever she has that's more suitable at shorter ranges.  She'll use 'nades as well and hasn't inadvertently hit me with any of them.  She's also quite adept at using the knife too.  Also, considering so many [i]players[/i] don't seem smart enough to effectively manage her inventory or hell, don't seem smart enough to acclimate themselves to not being able to shoot while moving, it almost seems unreasonable to expect Sheva to be much better than she is.

[quote=Jollipop]And the big problem here is that she wastes herbs because she doesn't combine them.[/quote]

Someone already mentioned that this is incorrect.  She does mix them.  She doesn't [i]anticipate[/i] that she might be picking up a red herb...and so won't [i]save[/i] herbs, but she still uses them effectively.

"If we can hit that bull's-eye, the rest of the dominoes will fall like a house of cards...Checkmate." - Zapp Brannigan

Viginti_Tres

Since 6515 Days

Posted by KORNdog

i will. but things like controls, inventroy and sheva's AI where pefectly guagable using the demo. sure i cant comment on things like story, character, set peices or bosses. but the chance of those things being an issue are slim anyway, the problems i have with the game are those that where present in the demo and are still present in the game.

Managing your inventory is part of the gamedesign. You can have a few things easily accessable, but you have to make decisions, and sometimes you have to live with the fact that you can't pick up every item you'll come across. And no, the demo does not represent how you'll be using your inventory. Actually it's a lot diffrent: You're able to increase the capacity of your weapons, thus less need to stack up ammo.

What I really like about this game is that it's more about decisions you make. You can have both characters use diffrent secondary/tertiery weapons, that means you can manage your ammo way better (example: You take a Shotgun and your partner a Rifle). You can have one stack up on hand grenades and the other on incendiary grenades. There are a lot of possible ways.

Then you have to decide when to shoot and when it's better to not do it. You'll encounter some situations where you have to take risks in order to succeed. In most of these situations you can minimize the risk by playing coop, so it makes it playing solo in fact quite a bit harder. It's more about anticipating these situations than the actual shooting itself. So no, the shooting is spot on for this kind of game.

In reply to

[quote=KORNdog]

i will. but things like controls, inventroy and sheva's AI where pefectly guagable using the demo. sure i cant comment on things like story, character, set peices or bosses. but the chance of those things being an issue are slim anyway, the problems i have with the game are those that where present in the demo and are still present in the game.[/quote]

Managing your inventory is part of the gamedesign. You can have a few things easily accessable, but you have to make decisions, and sometimes you have to live with the fact that you can't pick up every item you'll come across. And no, the demo does not represent how you'll be using your inventory. Actually it's a lot diffrent: You're able to increase the capacity of your weapons, thus less need to stack up ammo.

What I really like about this game is that it's more about decisions you make. You can have both characters use diffrent secondary/tertiery weapons, that means you can manage your ammo way better (example: You take a Shotgun and your partner a Rifle). You can have one stack up on hand grenades and the other on incendiary grenades. There are a lot of possible ways.

Then you have to decide when to shoot and when it's better to not do it. You'll encounter some situations where you have to take risks in order to succeed. In most of these situations you can minimize the risk by playing coop, so it makes it playing solo in fact quite a bit harder. It's more about anticipating these situations than the actual shooting itself. So no, the shooting is spot on for this kind of game.

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