When I found the Quake 4 images a couple of days ago, I said to myself: "No 720p versions, no news". But today I finally found them, so here they are, a little late, together with those two vehicles & multiplayer trailers from Quake 4.
Rumor is that this will be running at only 30fps on the 360. Is there any truth to this? Surely not. This really is not the type of game that you would want to run at 30fps. Looks really good though. Very Doom3ish of course, which is a good thing, even if a bit simpler looking than Doom3. It's interesting how these engines often have a distinctive look to them. The only thing i don't like about the Doom3 engine is how they try to make up for the lack of geometry with normal mapping. It just doesn't look as natural as using more geometry.
The lighting looks Xbox1 generation, with higher polygon counts on the models, more impressive particle effects and that is about it. I hope for the developer/publishers sake that this is a build that is a few months old, or this will be collecting dust on store shelves. I'm not impressed after seeing PGR3, GR3, Kameo, GOW, and other next gen titles graphics...
Doom3 engine was unbelivble when i saw it for the first time,or when i played the game.
But now?
It doesnt look so next gen i gotta be honest to say...
I mean it req 64 mb 3d card,while we gonna have a 3d card that has 512 mb...
Commented on 2005-09-19 18:19:34 In reply to QuezcatoL
Posted by QuezcatoL
Doom3 engine was unbelivble when i saw it for the first time,or when i played the game.
But now?
It doesnt look so next gen i gotta be honest to say...
I mean it req 64 mb 3d card,while we gonna have a 3d card that has 512 mb...
to be fair according to iD you need a 512mb GPU to run Doom 3 at it's absolute best settings
but this...... this doesnt' look near as good as doom 3, or even Quake IV on PC for some reason
Since when is 30fps slow? hell that's 5fps more than movies, if anything Quake 4, since it's not a racing game would be just the kind of game that wouldn't benifit of 60fps.
Commented on 2005-09-19 18:55:45 In reply to toelessfoot
Posted by toelessfoot
Since when is 30fps slow? hell that's 5fps more than movies, if anything Quake 4, since it's not a racing game would be just the kind of game that wouldn't benifit of 60fps.
Jeez.
all games benefit from higher framerate
higher framerate = smoother gameplay
I know I personally don't like playing an FPS on PC at < 100fps
I don't mind 40-50 fps on PC, although I've got a pretty good setup so the Source engine runs at 90-110. Doom III hit about 60-70, which shows that either the Source engine is more efficient of Doom III is ineffecient and better graphics. I'd say the latter is true.
I'd be happy with anything >30 on X360 because it's going through a TV, so it's to be expected.
Commented on 2005-09-19 20:28:53 In reply to Tupacolyte
Posted by Tupacolyte
all games benefit from higher framerate
higher framerate = smoother gameplay
I know I personally don't like playing an FPS on PC at < 100fps
Then just must be some sort of a super human. The human eye can't tell a diff between 80 and 100 fps. around 30 is what most eyes counts as smooth. 60 is a clear safezone. Why do you HDTV was created with 60fps as standard?
Smoother gameplay goes up to max 75 fps. All after that is just greed for more fps.
And bye the way. The screen does not show 100fps if you don't have a 100hz monitor and most goes around 75hz
Commented on 2005-09-19 20:31:19 In reply to Burglarize
Posted by cooleo_no1
high standards :O
I don't mind 40-50 fps on PC, although I've got a pretty good setup so the Source engine runs at 90-110. Doom III hit about 60-70, which shows that either the Source engine is more efficient of Doom III is ineffecient and better graphics. I'd say the latter is true.
I'd be happy with anything >30 on X360 because it's going through a TV, so it's to be expected.
Xbox 360 is stated for true 720p witch means that the machin must pump out at least 60 fps for the picture to be progressiv. A HDTV goes around 50/60hz. If you take 1080i the box only has to pump out the half couse the monitor rend 1 pic per 2 hz
First we have PGR probably be running at 30fps .. and now this. Seems like a pattern is forming - and we are finally getting to see that we are not getting 'true' next-generation performance.
PC users will laugh at any ideas of the 360 being next-gen if it cannot surpass top of the line PC performance for at least 6 months; and that is with games such as this (typical PC fodder) running at 60fps.. but start it off at 30fps and we have already lost any argument.
Commented on 2005-09-19 20:44:40 In reply to Slabs
Posted by Slabs
Elysium you've already shown you have no idea WHAT you are talking about in the two days you've been here, please give it a rest.
Thats right, because you define "next-generation" as "most games running at 30fps" whilst top of the line performance on a PC will already be running the same game at 60fps or higher? Maybe your the one with your head in the sand who cannot accept that many of us expected the 360 to be able to deliver much smoother gameplay across the board. We have endured 30fps games for the past X years on XBOX / PS2's etc.
Yes, its a *BIG* let-down to hear a game running with such poor frame-rates. Sheesh, I have seen a number of "first-hand" play writeups today that have directly compared the PC & 360 version and *ALL* have commented at the surprise at the lower-framerate; or as it was written in one, "slower more sluggish performance."
There really is little discernable difference for an action or FPS game at 30 or 60fps(any higher and you can't even tell). Look at Resident Evil 4 for the Gamecube, it only runs at 30fps, but it still plays smoothly. Really the only type of games where 60fps benefits gameplay are racing games or any game where you need to convey a sense of speed.
I also love how everybody are design and art critics for next generation, thats all I see people bitching about on alot of forums lately.
Yeah, PC users are going to give us a hard time for not having 60fps along side our full on high dynamic lighting, dynamic soft shadows and high level motion blur which takes away any actual need to have 60fps! Damn PC people...
Commented on 2005-09-19 20:59:14 In reply to Elysium
Posted by Elysium
Thats right, because you define "next-generation" as "most games running at 30fps" whilst top of the line performance on a PC will already be running the same game at 60fps or higher? Maybe your the one with your head in the sand who cannot accept that many of us expected the 360 to be able to deliver much smoother gameplay across the board. We have endured 30fps games for the past X years on XBOX / PS2's etc.
Yes, its a *BIG* let-down to hear a game running with such poor frame-rates. Sheesh, I have seen a number of "first-hand" play writeups today that have directly compared the PC & 360 version and *ALL* have commented at the surprise at the lower-framerate; or as it was written in one, "slower more sluggish performance."
PC ports that launching with the system are running at lower frame rates because of the immense difference between a single core PC and a multicore PowerPC architecture, regardless of how powerful the PowerPC setup may be. You quite simply CANNOT have any redundant code or else you aren't going to be efficient.
You may not believe me but once these developers have learned to adjust to the architecture we are going to see a HUGE difference in games. It will be more difficult than last gen because of the move away from x86 processing but it will happen because developers know that multicore programming is going to be needed for PC games in the near future anyway.
There will be plenty of 360 games that run at 60fps, mostly racers and fighters tho. Im sure we will see a couple FPS that run at 60 too. It really just depends on the dev and game more than the hardware, if you choose 30fps you can free up the hardware for more effects.
I don't get how people can whine so much about such small things. Ultimately it's a decision the developer must make for which suits it's game the best, if they think that their game would be made or broken by the framerate they'll reduce polygonal, particle, shader, draw, etc... complexity to bring up the framerate. Sure better developer will have cleaner less reduntant code and will be able to do more, but as a whole the developers will become more familiar with the architecture and they'll surely be able to squeeze much more out of their games in the futur. However i think what were seeing now is quite incredible for how early in the game it is, especially considering how smooth all the realtime demos are running now compared to how they were prior to TGS, it's really coming together.
Oh and BTW, I would rather have a locked framerate at 30fps than something that fluctuates from 40-60fps, fluctuating framerates are very unimersing.
Someone posts a RUMOR(!), and all guys like Elysium can do is jump on it and curse that damn week Xbox360...btw without having seen neither the 360, nor at least one game for themeselves.
That is so poor!
Guys, if you are so disappointed or if you are not interested in 360 anymore because of it´s poor performance that you all know about already, than do us a favour and write your rubbish in some PS-froums, and leave us the hell alone!
Oh, and don´t think that I´m a stupid little Xbox-fanbaoy, who can´t handle any critics...But your way of thinking and argumenting makes me sick!
Sorry
Commented on 2005-09-20 00:10:07 In reply to Slabs
Posted by Slabs
PC ports that launching with the system are running at lower frame rates because of the immense difference between a single core PC and a multicore PowerPC architecture, regardless of how powerful the PowerPC setup may be. You quite simply CANNOT have any redundant code or else you aren't going to be efficient.
You may not believe me but once these developers have learned to adjust to the architecture we are going to see a HUGE difference in games. It will be more difficult than last gen because of the move away from x86 processing but it will happen because developers know that multicore programming is going to be needed for PC games in the near future anyway.
With the greatest respect it is all very well saying that "once developers have learned to adjust" we are then going to see games that demonstrate the 'real' power of the 360; this is not going to do much good for the system prior to this point. The recent comments coming from Edge magazine suggesting that that the 360 is little more than a "Playstation 2.5" whilst obviously being innacurate, might not be that far from the truth.
It is a simple fact that many development houses are already concerned that many of their programmers are not well versed with multi-core technology and therefore already see themselves struggling with the next generation systems. This is reflecting in games such as Q4 that is showing a more weakened game on console.
I go back to the point that games should be developed with "true" next-generation performance; and that means 60fps across the board. 30fps is from a bygone era ..
The reality remains that very few developers are going to have the resources and the time to get the best out of a multicore setup; so its not going to happen for the majority of games.. possibly only the dedicated 360 "only" games. PGR anyone.. Oh yes, thats 30fps too.
Maybe if you stopped making excuses we wouldn't be in this sorry mess. But hey, lets just see the previews continue and the frame-issues get mentioned and see how the hardcore gamers are going to take to the news that their new console is showing signs of faltering before it even got off the ground.
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All comments (32)
Commented on 2005-09-19 16:36:08
Commented on 2005-09-19 16:38:49
Commented on 2005-09-19 16:41:55
Commented on 2005-09-19 16:49:00But now?
It doesnt look so next gen i gotta be honest to say...
I mean it req 64 mb 3d card,while we gonna have a 3d card that has 512 mb...
Commented on 2005-09-19 16:51:38Ofc this engine was out long before it came though.
Commented on 2005-09-19 18:19:34 In reply to QuezcatoLBut now?
It doesnt look so next gen i gotta be honest to say...
I mean it req 64 mb 3d card,while we gonna have a 3d card that has 512 mb...
but this...... this doesnt' look near as good as doom 3, or even Quake IV on PC for some reason
Commented on 2005-09-19 18:43:05Jeez.
Commented on 2005-09-19 18:55:45 In reply to toelessfootJeez.
higher framerate = smoother gameplay
I know I personally don't like playing an FPS on PC at < 100fps
Commented on 2005-09-19 20:27:07I don't mind 40-50 fps on PC, although I've got a pretty good setup so the Source engine runs at 90-110. Doom III hit about 60-70, which shows that either the Source engine is more efficient of Doom III is ineffecient and better graphics. I'd say the latter is true.
I'd be happy with anything >30 on X360 because it's going through a TV, so it's to be expected.
Commented on 2005-09-19 20:28:53 In reply to Tupacolytehigher framerate = smoother gameplay
I know I personally don't like playing an FPS on PC at < 100fps
Smoother gameplay goes up to max 75 fps. All after that is just greed for more fps.
And bye the way. The screen does not show 100fps if you don't have a 100hz monitor and most goes around 75hz
Commented on 2005-09-19 20:31:19 In reply to BurglarizeI don't mind 40-50 fps on PC, although I've got a pretty good setup so the Source engine runs at 90-110. Doom III hit about 60-70, which shows that either the Source engine is more efficient of Doom III is ineffecient and better graphics. I'd say the latter is true.
I'd be happy with anything >30 on X360 because it's going through a TV, so it's to be expected.
Commented on 2005-09-19 20:32:49PC users will laugh at any ideas of the 360 being next-gen if it cannot surpass top of the line PC performance for at least 6 months; and that is with games such as this (typical PC fodder) running at 60fps.. but start it off at 30fps and we have already lost any argument.
<Sigh> ..
Commented on 2005-09-19 20:35:17
Commented on 2005-09-19 20:40:55 In reply to Slabs
Commented on 2005-09-19 20:44:40 In reply to SlabsYes, its a *BIG* let-down to hear a game running with such poor frame-rates. Sheesh, I have seen a number of "first-hand" play writeups today that have directly compared the PC & 360 version and *ALL* have commented at the surprise at the lower-framerate; or as it was written in one, "slower more sluggish performance."
Commented on 2005-09-19 20:48:18I also love how everybody are design and art critics for next generation, thats all I see people bitching about on alot of forums lately.
Commented on 2005-09-19 20:49:15
Commented on 2005-09-19 20:59:14 In reply to ElysiumYes, its a *BIG* let-down to hear a game running with such poor frame-rates. Sheesh, I have seen a number of "first-hand" play writeups today that have directly compared the PC & 360 version and *ALL* have commented at the surprise at the lower-framerate; or as it was written in one, "slower more sluggish performance."
You may not believe me but once these developers have learned to adjust to the architecture we are going to see a HUGE difference in games. It will be more difficult than last gen because of the move away from x86 processing but it will happen because developers know that multicore programming is going to be needed for PC games in the near future anyway.
Commented on 2005-09-19 21:00:54
Commented on 2005-09-19 21:14:17 In reply to Dre_realla
Commented on 2005-09-19 21:20:48
Commented on 2005-09-19 22:22:35Oh and BTW, I would rather have a locked framerate at 30fps than something that fluctuates from 40-60fps, fluctuating framerates are very unimersing.
Commented on 2005-09-19 23:16:14That is so poor!
Guys, if you are so disappointed or if you are not interested in 360 anymore because of it´s poor performance that you all know about already, than do us a favour and write your rubbish in some PS-froums, and leave us the hell alone!
Oh, and don´t think that I´m a stupid little Xbox-fanbaoy, who can´t handle any critics...But your way of thinking and argumenting makes me sick!
Sorry
Commented on 2005-09-19 23:24:03
Commented on 2005-09-20 00:10:07 In reply to SlabsYou may not believe me but once these developers have learned to adjust to the architecture we are going to see a HUGE difference in games. It will be more difficult than last gen because of the move away from x86 processing but it will happen because developers know that multicore programming is going to be needed for PC games in the near future anyway.
It is a simple fact that many development houses are already concerned that many of their programmers are not well versed with multi-core technology and therefore already see themselves struggling with the next generation systems. This is reflecting in games such as Q4 that is showing a more weakened game on console.
I go back to the point that games should be developed with "true" next-generation performance; and that means 60fps across the board. 30fps is from a bygone era ..
The reality remains that very few developers are going to have the resources and the time to get the best out of a multicore setup; so its not going to happen for the majority of games.. possibly only the dedicated 360 "only" games. PGR anyone.. Oh yes, thats 30fps too.
Maybe if you stopped making excuses we wouldn't be in this sorry mess. But hey, lets just see the previews continue and the frame-issues get mentioned and see how the hardcore gamers are going to take to the news that their new console is showing signs of faltering before it even got off the ground.