Halo Reach

Since 7030 Days

What does.. being all anal about the military stuff have to.. do with production value? I just.. man I disagree so much with your post my head's just spinning. Ah well.

We're all hoping we'll like the game, I guess that in a way puts us all on the same page.

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http://modeseven.blogspot.com | Dominic and Simon - dyanamic games blog duo!
Twitter: @simonlundmark

GriftGFX

Since 7007 Days

Posted by LEBATO

Meh, let's end this. I just think it just doesn't fit. Science fiction has limits. Good stories are explained, in reasonable ways.

It's a videogame. Trying to hold it up to the same standards as motion pictures is going to lead to disappointment time and time again.

I think you're being really nitpicky.

In reply to

Optimusv2

Since 6899 Days

What does it have to do with production value? To make a long story short, A number of attempts, too many for comfort, to lend any sort of credibility to a lot of what was going on in Halo 3 looked so sloppy that you found it incredibly difficult to take any scene where they attempted to showcase any sort of military or UNSC command structure of any kind serious. In more cases than not, it was actually outright painful to watch for a next generation title.

In a sense, you were left begging for Halo, a franchise that shouldn't at all be having problems in these areas, to draw some positive influence from what the Modern Warfare games do right. In COD4, you had a more limited scope of a war than anything going on in Halo 3, still come off seeming many more times epic and exciting, and a big reason for that is there was a massive quality gap between the two games and a lot of that had to do with the production values.

So, in short, Reach seems like it's headed in the direction where Halo is finally being treated like the proper killer app franchise that it is. There's really no reason it should've felt so behind other titles in the genre, when it's one of the biggest franchises out there and pulls in more money than just about any other.

In reply to

What does it have to do with production value? To make a long story short, A number of attempts, too many for comfort, to lend any sort of credibility to a lot of what was going on in Halo 3 looked so sloppy that you found it incredibly difficult to take any scene where they attempted to showcase any sort of military or UNSC command structure of any kind serious. In more cases than not, it was actually outright painful to watch for a next generation title.

In a sense, you were left begging for Halo, a franchise that shouldn't at all be having problems in these areas, to draw some positive influence from what the Modern Warfare games do right. In COD4, you had a more limited scope of a war than anything going on in Halo 3, still come off seeming many more times epic and exciting, and a big reason for that is there was a massive quality gap between the two games and a lot of that had to do with the production values.

So, in short, Reach seems like it's headed in the direction where Halo is finally being treated like the proper killer app franchise that it is. There's really no reason it should've felt so behind other titles in the genre, when it's one of the biggest franchises out there and pulls in more money than just about any other.

Halo Reach using 360 tesselation unit extensively.

Hironobu Sakaguchi is coming back to reclaim the throne :)

Seeing it in motion on your HDTV, will blow your mind!!

Don't ask any questions just shut up and buy Halo : Ghosts of the Onyx one of th

GriftGFX

Since 7007 Days

Halo 3 isn't a "proper killer app?" Oh boy...

To me, Halo 3 still represents the best of the Xbox. It's the complete package. Is the campaign perfect? Far from it, but it's still the most feature rich experience on the platform. It's Xbox Live's killer app, just like Halo 2 was. From co-op, to forge, to the epic online experience in general, Halo 3 can't really be beat (still).

In reply to

SimonM7

Since 7030 Days

Yeah, no, no. :)

I thought there was pageyness, but there's isn't. :)

In reply to

http://modeseven.blogspot.com | Dominic and Simon - dyanamic games blog duo!
Twitter: @simonlundmark

Optimusv2

Since 6899 Days

For a franchise as big as it is, and for a franchise that makes as much money as it does, and for a studio as well equipped as Bungie is, no way it wasn't. That's just being honest. I love the game, but so many aspects of the presentation looked downright embarrasing for a game THAT big and you know that's true.

Miranda and Johnson's death were also so badly hammed up that they should've been left alive solely for the sake of dying a proper death in a future continuation of the Chief's side of the story. But that's just my opinion on what I saw. Even Halo 2 in a lot of cases stomps Halo 3 into the ground. The more fun to play game was surely Halo 3, but the better presented game, I thought, was Halo 2 by a country mile.

Oh yea, I'll never question the overall package and it being worth the money, but I'm purely speaking in regards to the SP campaign, which is what I care the most about in a Halo title for the most part. I didn't like how a lot of the cutscenes were handled for an Xbox 360 title, and not just any Xbox 360 title, Halo, the game that was supposedly suppose to "finish the fight"

In reply to

For a franchise as big as it is, and for a franchise that makes as much money as it does, and for a studio as well equipped as Bungie is, no way it wasn't. That's just being honest. I love the game, but so many aspects of the presentation looked downright embarrasing for a game THAT big and you know that's true.

Miranda and Johnson's death were also so badly hammed up that they should've been left alive solely for the sake of dying a proper death in a future continuation of the Chief's side of the story. But that's just my opinion on what I saw. Even Halo 2 in a lot of cases stomps Halo 3 into the ground. The more fun to play game was surely Halo 3, but the better presented game, I thought, was Halo 2 by a country mile.

Oh yea, I'll never question the overall package and it being worth the money, but I'm purely speaking in regards to the SP campaign, which is what I care the most about in a Halo title for the most part. I didn't like how a lot of the cutscenes were handled for an Xbox 360 title, and not just any Xbox 360 title, Halo, the game that was supposedly suppose to "finish the fight"

Halo Reach using 360 tesselation unit extensively.

Hironobu Sakaguchi is coming back to reclaim the throne :)

Seeing it in motion on your HDTV, will blow your mind!!

Don't ask any questions just shut up and buy Halo : Ghosts of the Onyx one of th

Optimusv2

Since 6899 Days

Oh cool, someone put together all the tech info from the article on GAF.

I think a lot of people will like what they see.

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1927350...

•Refined approach to distance and detail
•Allows dramatically expanded number of enemies, light sources and other details
•Described as "imposter tech"
•Level of Detail (LOD) system allows building of bigger and more populated spaces for exploration
•Distant objects are rendered at low poly with cheaper shaders, ie "imposters"
•Imposter look great at distance and detail increases the closer you get to them
•Less chance of pop-up and stippling as environmental geometry, plants, buildings, enemies or anything else can be placed into the visual field at the same extreme distances without profound hit to system performance
•At extreme close range items can be rendered with incredible detail, ie, a wall was shown from inches away with tiny rivet features in the metal popped on the screen with perfect clarity
•Imposter system indirectly frees up memory which can be devoted to other technical aspects
•Lighting being one of those aspects
•From Halo 3's 3 or 4 light sources, Reach's engine presents 20 to 40 dynamic lights at the same time
•Weapon effects benefit greatly from the improved lighting, ie Plasma bolts moving across the screen with their own independent light source, casting colour and shadow across the environment
•More improved lighting examples, a Warthog gun firing at a wall with hundred of real sparks flying from the stone, the particles interact not just with the wall geometry, but with it's normal map additionally, the particles scatter down onto a nearby vehicle and react with its curves and lines, the sparks bounce and flow along the tiny textured surface
•New weather system bringing rain to many missions, adding to the atmosphere
•The sky is no longer a sky-box like past Halo games, it's a true space in the overall environment, ie a ship descends from orbit and towards you, you can watch it make the full descent as a real object would fall
•Motion capture heavily implemented, a majority of the cut-scenes based on captured actions
•On-screen characters exhibit an animation technique known as variable gait blending, when a character changes speed, ie walking to running and vice versa, the animation of walking blends seamlessly into running and then sprinting, also, when turning on a pivot, players no longer stay still and magically turn in a circle, they realistically move around the pivot with their bodies and lifting their feet in reaction
•Bungie hired company Image Metrics to aid with human faces, which now appear dramatically more lifelike than Halo's traditional potato faces

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1927284...

This guy's statement is 100% true. Can't wait for Bungie to upload them, I want to make one my pc background.

I just got my GI issue in the mail today and I have to say: you guys really need to check out a hard copy for yourselves. The scans leaked online don't do the pictures ANY justice. All the excessive glare is causing those pictures to lose detail.

When you look at the scans straight from the magazine (what I'm doing right now), they look SUPERB and damn near close to the VGA trailer, especially the picture of the AR being fired in FP view.

Oh and if this amounts to anything: If what I'm seeing from that AR-in-first-person-view picture is correct, then the AR's clip has been reduced from 32 to 28.

In reply to

Oh cool, someone put together all the tech info from the article on GAF.

I think a lot of people will like what they see.

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=19273502&postcount=5581

[quote]•Refined approach to distance and detail
•Allows dramatically expanded number of enemies, light sources and other details
•Described as "imposter tech"
•Level of Detail (LOD) system allows building of bigger and more populated spaces for exploration
•Distant objects are rendered at low poly with cheaper shaders, ie "imposters"
•[b]Imposter look great at distance and detail increases the closer you get to them
•Less chance of pop-up and stippling as environmental geometry, plants, buildings, enemies or anything else can be placed into the visual field at the same extreme distances without profound hit to system performance
•At extreme close range items can be rendered with incredible detail, ie, a wall was shown from inches away with tiny rivet features in the metal popped on the screen with perfect clarity
•Imposter system indirectly frees up memory which can be devoted to other technical aspects[/b]
•Lighting being one of those aspects
•From Halo 3's 3 or 4 light sources, Reach's engine presents 20 to 40 dynamic lights at the same time
•Weapon effects benefit greatly from the improved lighting, [b]ie Plasma bolts moving across the screen with their own independent light source, casting colour and shadow across the environment[/b]
•[b]More improved lighting examples, a Warthog gun firing at a wall with hundred of real sparks flying from the stone, the particles interact not just with the wall geometry, but with it's normal map additionally, the particles scatter down onto a nearby vehicle and react with its curves and lines, the sparks bounce and flow along the tiny textured surface[/b]
•[b]New weather system bringing rain to many missions, adding to the atmosphere[/b]
•The sky is no longer a sky-box like past Halo games, [b]it's a true space in the overall environment, ie a ship descends from orbit and towards you, you can watch it make the full descent as a real object would fall[/b]
•Motion capture heavily implemented, [b]a majority of the cut-scenes based on captured actions[/b]
•[b]On-screen characters exhibit an animation technique known as variable gait blending, when a character changes speed, ie walking to running and vice versa, the animation of walking blends seamlessly into running and then sprinting, also, when turning on a pivot, players no longer stay still and magically turn in a circle, they realistically move around the pivot with their bodies and lifting their feet in reaction[/b]
•Bungie hired company Image Metrics to aid with human faces, which now appear dramatically more lifelike than Halo's traditional potato faces[/quote]

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=19272844&postcount=5577

This guy's statement is 100% true. Can't wait for Bungie to upload them, I want to make one my pc background.

[quote]I just got my GI issue in the mail today and I have to say: you guys really need to check out a hard copy for yourselves. [b]The scans leaked online don't do the pictures ANY justice. All the excessive glare is causing those pictures to lose detail.

When you look at the scans straight from the magazine (what I'm doing right now), they look SUPERB and damn near close to the VGA trailer, especially the picture of the AR being fired in FP view.[/b]

Oh and if this amounts to anything: If what I'm seeing from that AR-in-first-person-view picture is correct, then the AR's clip has been reduced from 32 to 28.[/quote]

Halo Reach using 360 tesselation unit extensively.

Hironobu Sakaguchi is coming back to reclaim the throne :)

Seeing it in motion on your HDTV, will blow your mind!!

Don't ask any questions just shut up and buy Halo : Ghosts of the Onyx one of th

dcdelgado

Since 6867 Days

I Love the new look Halo Reach is taking, and i am super hyped at all these amazing things i'm hearing about this game.

In reply to

** Yes We CAN!! **

roxwell

Since 6955 Days

If there's going to be 4 Spartans I would like more than 40 AI seeing as 20 couldn't stop one.
It's a start though, but I'd rather 80 :p

In reply to

DLC is the work of the Devil

BLackHawkodst

Since 5894 Days

I'm just blown away buy all this stuff i'm hearing, Halo3 was already the most feature filled FPS out there and Reach is blowing it out of the water, with still loads more stuff to be revealed.

In reply to

Prepare To Drop!!

Frozpot

Since 6766 Days

Posted by GriftGFX

It's a videogame. Trying to hold it up to the same standards as motion pictures is going to lead to disappointment time and time again.

I think you're being really nitpicky.

Not to mention it is done in all kinds of movies. Ever see Enemy at the gates? They are speaking in English, but it's supposed to be Russian. There are plenty of instances where this is done in film. It's like the Movie translates for you so that you can get the benefit of delivery...

In reply to

Oooh, Profound, isn't it?

Ronsauce

Since 6992 Days

Ok...I'm now a good deal more excited after reading some info and seeing the scans. It seems like it's shaping up nicely thus far. I had to laugh at this though:

Bungie hired company Image Metrics to aid with human faces, which now appear dramatically more lifelike than Halo's traditional potato faces

They enlist an outside firm to help...yet the faces(at least in the trailer) look semi-plastic? Come on guys!

Ah well. Minor gripe. Probably won't even really notice while playing.

In reply to

Zapp Brannigan: If we can hit that bull's-eye, the rest of the dominoes will fall like a house of cards...Checkmate.

blmbox

Since 6338 Days

Posted by Frozpot

Not to mention it is done in all kinds of movies. Ever see Enemy at the gates? They are speaking in English, but it's supposed to be Russian. There are plenty of instances where this is done in film. It's like the Movie translates for you so that you can get the benefit of delivery...

Same as the TV show 24, for instance. The terrorists always alternate between English and their own language, even when speaking to their fellow countrymen. I don't make anything of it because I know that it's done for the audience's benefit - and 24 has always been about maintaining realistic aspects.

In reply to

Freniger

Since 7023 Days

I also have the new GI, and while the graphics are very nice, I think it would look a whole lot nicer without this brown/yellow fog crap covering the whole scene. Even though they're touting their new "imposter tech" LOD system, this effect makes me think the game has a poor draw distance. Some distant backround objects are nearly invisible.

In reply to

deftangel

Since 6875 Days

Posted by Freniger

I also have the new GI, and while the graphics are very nice, I think it would look a whole lot nicer without this brown/yellow fog crap covering the whole scene. Even though they're touting their new "imposter tech" LOD system, this effect makes me think the game has a poor draw distance. Some distant backround objects are nearly invisible.

Halo 3's engine had a theoretical draw distance of miles. I doubt they've binned that tech entirely.

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http://twitter.com/deftangel

Ronsauce

Since 6992 Days

Maybe the fog is endemic to a certain level and isn't prevalent throughout the whole game? This is probably more than likely.

In reply to

Zapp Brannigan: If we can hit that bull's-eye, the rest of the dominoes will fall like a house of cards...Checkmate.

Optimusv2

Since 6899 Days

Isn't that just the visual style though they are going for in some of the game's locations? They even take care to point out the weather system and how there will be rain. I'd expect some instances where things in the background may not immediately be visible, but if you look at the game informer cover art, you'll notice some gun or satellite dish thing in the background. On one of the few HUD gameplay pics presented, you clearly also see that same object in the distance.

Actually, according to the details in the mag, it's most likely the communicationis platform that connects Reach to the rest of the UNSC. I have a suspicious feeling that we'll spot that highly advanced black sphere probe that was talked about in Halo : Ghosts of Onyx. It's a probe so advanced that it contains the ability to traverse slipspace as far and as fast as any UNSC ship.

Also, seeing as how you'll be seeing things descend from way up in the air, I don't know how big a concern the draw distance will be. Man, hopefully the Gameinformer update will be really good tomorrow.

In reply to

Isn't that just the visual style though they are going for in some of the game's locations? They even take care to point out the weather system and how there will be rain. I'd expect some instances where things in the background may not immediately be visible, but if you look at the game informer cover art, you'll notice some gun or satellite dish thing in the background. On one of the few HUD gameplay pics presented, you clearly also see that same object in the distance.

Actually, according to the details in the mag, it's most likely the communicationis platform that connects Reach to the rest of the UNSC. I have a suspicious feeling that we'll spot that highly advanced black sphere probe that was talked about in Halo : Ghosts of Onyx. It's a probe so advanced that it contains the ability to traverse slipspace as far and as fast as any UNSC ship.

Also, seeing as how you'll be seeing things descend from way up in the air, I don't know how big a concern the draw distance will be. Man, hopefully the Gameinformer update will be really good tomorrow.

Halo Reach using 360 tesselation unit extensively.

Hironobu Sakaguchi is coming back to reclaim the throne :)

Seeing it in motion on your HDTV, will blow your mind!!

Don't ask any questions just shut up and buy Halo : Ghosts of the Onyx one of th

Freniger

Since 7023 Days

It probably is a just a design choice (it's even prevalent on the magazine cover art). But still, I hope it doesn't look like that throughout the whole game.

In reply to

Optimusv2

Since 6899 Days

Yea, I doubt it, when more devastating things start happening we'll need a nice view of the destruction.

In reply to

Halo Reach using 360 tesselation unit extensively.

Hironobu Sakaguchi is coming back to reclaim the throne :)

Seeing it in motion on your HDTV, will blow your mind!!

Don't ask any questions just shut up and buy Halo : Ghosts of the Onyx one of th

deftangel

Since 6875 Days

Posted by Freniger

It probably is a just a design choice (it's even prevalent on the magazine cover art). But still, I hope it doesn't look like that throughout the whole game.

If they are going for scale, then nerfing the draw distance wouldn't make sense. Neither would their imposter system either. Bungie are also quite big on 'clean' visual design. i.e. they wouldn't want a player to be surprised by an enemy popping out of the fog unless that was their specific intention.

I'd wait to see a bit more media before jumping to that conclusion.

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http://twitter.com/deftangel

dcdelgado

Since 6867 Days

When does the UK Edge mag hit the shelves?

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** Yes We CAN!! **

deftangel

Since 6875 Days

Sometime next week. I usually get it a couple of days early which is usually a day after it leaks on rmluk/GAF

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http://twitter.com/deftangel

szaromir

Since 6764 Days

Did Bungie ever comment on Brutes in Halo Reach? There is a weird absence of them in the GI article, none on screens and no Brutes weapons as well. I hope they'll be in the game for diversity reasons, but will get a serious redesign.

In reply to

"That just happened 'cause that was awesome" - Randy Pitchford, Gearbox

deftangel

Since 6875 Days

Posted by szaromir

Did Bungie ever comment on Brutes in Halo Reach? There is a weird absence of them in the GI article, none on screens and no Brutes weapons as well. I hope they'll be in the game for diversity reasons, but will get a serious redesign.

Not officially. I would wager they aren't though.

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http://twitter.com/deftangel

Optimusv2

Since 6899 Days

I suspect they may very well be in the game, but perhaps they'll be used in a far more exclusive and limited means. For example, I expect we'll see them on possibly important Covenant ships, sorta like was the case with the book Halo : First Strike.

In reply to

Halo Reach using 360 tesselation unit extensively.

Hironobu Sakaguchi is coming back to reclaim the throne :)

Seeing it in motion on your HDTV, will blow your mind!!

Don't ask any questions just shut up and buy Halo : Ghosts of the Onyx one of th

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